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#155564 by wood07
18 Jan 2007, 12:36
Originally posted by HighFlyer
Originally posted by pixuk

Edit to add: As HF says, Parallels Desktop is also a piece of software that lets you run Windows within OS X, so you don't even need to reboot to run your Windows applications.


And a shameless plug to say that its actually my company's product, so if anyone wants copies or liscencing, just get in touch :)

Thanks,
Sarah


I'd be very interested to hear how well XP runs on OS X with Parallels. Would love to change work PC to Mac but a couple of essential PC only apps have detered me thus far.
#155567 by HighFlyer
18 Jan 2007, 12:43
XP will run near native, though if you have a well spec'd Macbook Pro, it will often seem a lot faster than native. There are several consumer reviews on the subject, or you can download the free trial version and test it for yourself. You'll need a copy of XP to use Parallels though.

Pete - can you get a refund ;)

Thanks,
Sarah
#155568 by Pete
18 Jan 2007, 12:48
No I can't - I broke the shrink wrap (specifically against Amazon's ToS on returns of software). Ah well, not to worry. ;)
#155605 by fozzyo
18 Jan 2007, 15:53
My current PC is an AMD Athlon XP 1.8GHz with 1GB of RAM. Just about working.

My next machine will be an Apple iMac with out any cables ... well just a power lead.
#155675 by Scrooge
18 Jan 2007, 19:43
Very interesting thread this is turning into.

Ok now this was explained to me before, but not since the switch to Intel boards.

So can I take my new rig and load OS X on to it, then load boot camp and XP/Vista?

As I have my heart set on this motherboard due to it having 3 16 x pci-e and is pretty easy to play with while being stable as hell and something tells me that whatever mobo apple is using will have nowhere near the performance or the ability to tune and upgrade with in the future.
#155736 by Bazz
18 Jan 2007, 22:14
Well Dave that is the "Mother" of all motherboards, going to cost a bit to populate it to take advantage of the full capability though.
#155745 by HighFlyer
18 Jan 2007, 22:42
Not sure about the Nvidia card Dave, some need to be reflashed to work optimally with OS X. Geforce and ATi can be flashed easily and go on to work well, but i dont know of specific models and such. You'd be better off with x86 Tiger! We have a copy in the office and i want it on all the clients, OS X on a PC! Brill!

Part of the reason i think Macs 'just work' is that you buy the Mac with all the hardware already inside and pre-built and tested to be compatible. When you start building your own in the way you build a PC i think you may open up a potential can of worms unless you know what you are doing. I have built several PCs and not had much trouble with them, but when you have companies dedicated to designing the best hardware for the job, maybe they know best after all the research they have done. If you have an issue with your Mac you can just go back to any Apple store and get it sorted out, you cant get that (easily) with Dell, and you cant get it at all with something you have built or modified.

I have been brought up to build PCs, but now i kind of like the lazy approach to buying a Mac, taking it out of its box and having it there and ready to use straight away. No drivers, no problems. The only issue is the updates you often have to download, but thats the same as any PC - only i'm working away when Mr PC is trying to figure out what his graphics card is to get a driver for it!

Thanks,
Sarah
#155747 by Pete
18 Jan 2007, 22:51
Dave, if part of the fun for you is tinkering under the hood, stick with a home brew PC. If you want a well-spec'd box that looks great, runs any operating system you care to throw at it and can be upgraded in terms of drive, memory or expansion cards, take a look at the Mac Pro.
#155749 by Scrooge
18 Jan 2007, 22:52
Originally posted by Bazz
Well Dave that is the "Mother" of all motherboards, going to cost a bit to populate it to take advantage of the full capability though.


There are somethings I do not mind spending money on..in hind sight we should of put a sticky up somewhere so I could post my upgrade each year.

Right now I am looking at

That mobo
Pentium D 960 ( why cant they go back to the number system)
4 gigs of ram

2 x 2 150 gig raptors in raid 0 array + 2 x WD5000KS-RC in a raid 0 array for storage

2 x GeForce 7900GS OC in SLI

then all the optical drives as well...well only two in fact.

It should be a pretty good system and it may even keep me happy for a year or so...with any luck the quad core procs will be socket 775 so I can just put one in,..though if someone ever comes out with a dual proc board again I may just have to start again :D
#155751 by Scrooge
18 Jan 2007, 22:57
Originally posted by pixuk
Dave, if part of the fun for you is tinkering under the hood, stick with a home brew PC. If you want a well-spec'd box that looks great, runs any operating system you care to throw at it and can be upgraded in terms of drive, memory or expansion cards, take a look at the Mac Pro.


Im looking at it now..I would have to rip out the video card and replace it with two 7900's as I have them in hand.

Any idea what speed the pci-e ports run at?
#155757 by Scrooge
18 Jan 2007, 23:11
Ok just spent some time on the mac website..after having Paul yell buy a Mac at me.

Couple of problems I see...The pro runs on an Xeon chipset, great for servers, not so good for desktops.

It has 4 x pcie ports..but only 300 watts max..what is the point of having 4 ports when they are gutless.

spec'd close but lower than mine it comes in at $4603..only $2k more than mine, I mean I would be willing to give it a go..but come on $2k is $2k....

Bang goes the argument that Mac's are the same price as Pc's
#155759 by Pete
18 Jan 2007, 23:12
The bottom slot is an "x16" (8 gigabytes per second of data throughput) "double-wide" slot intended for video cards with oversize cooling fans. Of the remaining three slots, two are x4 and the last is x1. In terms of bandwidth, this means 2 GBps and 500 MBps, respectively.
#155764 by VS075
18 Jan 2007, 23:22
Originally posted by HighFlyer
Not sure about the Nvidia card Dave, some need to be reflashed to work optimally with OS X. Geforce and ATi can be flashed easily and go on to work well, but i dont know of specific models and such. You'd be better off with x86 Tiger! We have a copy in the office and i want it on all the clients, OS X on a PC! Brill!

Part of the reason i think Macs 'just work' is that you buy the Mac with all the hardware already inside and pre-built and tested to be compatible. When you start building your own in the way you build a PC i think you may open up a potential can of worms unless you know what you are doing. I have built several PCs and not had much trouble with them, but when you have companies dedicated to designing the best hardware for the job, maybe they know best after all the research they have done. If you have an issue with your Mac you can just go back to any Apple store and get it sorted out, you cant get that (easily) with Dell, and you cant get it at all with something you have built or modified.

I have been brought up to build PCs, but now i kind of like the lazy approach to buying a Mac, taking it out of its box and having it there and ready to use straight away. No drivers, no problems. The only issue is the updates you often have to download, but thats the same as any PC - only i'm working away when Mr PC is trying to figure out what his graphics card is to get a driver for it!

Thanks,
Sarah


All excellent points I must say.

Personally I'm a PC nut through and through and I couldn't justify a Mac over a PC unless I needed it for designing etc. With PC's I like the ability to be able to upgrade it and have it to how I want it (I added more memory to my desktop 2 months back) which you couldn't realistically (or should I say easily) do with a Mac.

As for resolving problems then you can take a Mac back to the Apple store and have it solved, but I like the fact that with a PC you can try and solve it yourself (if you're into computers/IT that is). If for example a CD drive is broken its a simple case of lifting the case and swapping it for a new CD drive...with an iMac its got to go back to Apple.

Ok it seems bias of me to be attacking the strong points of a Mac and I suppose its all down to personal preference. But at the end of the day, no matter their limitations, a PC will suit me hands down and I've been truly satisfied.
#155768 by HighFlyer
18 Jan 2007, 23:29
To be fair, we upgraded the RAM in my Macbook recently. Just swapped the DDRAM (x2 256's for x2 1024's) and now my bottom rung baby Macbook just flies. It wasnt hard, and the RAM wasnt anything special - it came out of an old laptop.

You can upgrade Macs, parts can be more expensive in some areas but i guess that is because less people order them - supply and demand. Also, you dont need to change things as often as they are of a higher quality. For example, Macs do not have the 'paper clip eject' on the CD drives. I thought this was an error at first as i have had to use this option countless times to eject a disc from my PCs - never had the issue on a Mac. If you are into computers you can solve a lot of Mac issues as well, but troubleshooting differs to deciding what motherboard and chip configuration is best.

PCs and Macs are different, and they suit different people. I dont berate anyone for preferring a PC, i just think that they dont always know what they are missing. My Mum now has a Mac Mini and gets on very well with it, and she was very much a Windows person and is certainly a good example of how Macs are not just for geeks and pro's.

Thanks,
Sarah
#155774 by Pete
18 Jan 2007, 23:45
Originally posted by VS075

With PC's I like the ability to be able to upgrade it and have it to how I want it (I added more memory to my desktop 2 months back) which you couldn't realistically (or should I say easily) do with a Mac.

As for resolving problems then you can take a Mac back to the Apple store and have it solved, but I like the fact that with a PC you can try and solve it yourself (if you're into computers/IT that is). If for example a CD drive is broken its a simple case of lifting the case and swapping it for a new CD drive...with an iMac its got to go back to Apple.


To be fair, neither of those two examples should be any more difficult on a Mac. Some people are afraid of opening a Mac, as there's a perception that it's all custom hardware inside. The reality is that the CD drive, RAM, hard disk will all work on both (assuming they're the right spec - but essentially, off-the-shelf components of the right type from PC World can be dropped into your Mac). Apple don't actually make all the components themselves. If you take a peak inside an unmodified Mac, you'll see the familiar logos of Sony, IBM, Seagate, etc; bits you could take out and plug into a PC.

I've even upgraded my PowerBook, (which originally came with a DVD ROM drive) to a generic DVD-R recorder I bought off eBay. The hard disk in it has been upgraded a couple of times as drives have gotten bigger - just using standard 2.5" drives bought from dabs.com. Apart from the stuff that is soldered onto the motherboard, pretty much everything that you would normally upgrade/replace on a PC, you can do the same on the Mac.
#155878 by VS075
19 Jan 2007, 12:42
My points were made on no experience of Macs at all so I stand corrected. I don't actually hate anyone who preffers a Mac over a PC but as said before I'm a PC bod so it will probably take a lot of persuasion to fully convert me to a Mac.

Whatever floats your boat I guess!
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