Could BA go bust?
Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 12:19Page 1 of 1
Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 12:19Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 12:24Doubt it. Too politically sensitive. Most likely nationalised or given a huge bailout.
Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 12:30I think of greater note are SRB's comments about Virgin having taken a look at buying BA - I suspect a dose of Branson fancifuness there!
Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 12:54BA has to publish annual accounts, drawn up to set standards. Virgin publishes it's accounts in a somewhat more creative manner.
I've read the Sunday Times article today. Whilst Virgin does not have the huge pension scheme deficit that BA has, it does compete with BA on the majority of it's routes.
If BA are suffering from a huge fall in passenger numbers, particularly at the front of the plane, then I fail to believe that Virgin are not suffering as well. (Despite what their annual results may have said).
I've read the Sunday Times article today. Whilst Virgin does not have the huge pension scheme deficit that BA has, it does compete with BA on the majority of it's routes.
If BA are suffering from a huge fall in passenger numbers, particularly at the front of the plane, then I fail to believe that Virgin are not suffering as well. (Despite what their annual results may have said).
Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 13:08Well done to BA for this: they should have done it long ago
See how low cost airline charges add up
See how low cost airline charges add up
Posted: 21 Jun 2009, 13:54Yes the see how low cost airline charges add up was a master plan on BA's part, but they should have done that years ago. It was BA's arrogance that no one would fly those airline for the cheap frill when they had the service of BA aircraft for more. People voted with their wallets and easyjet and ryanair made millions off of BA.etc NOw people are finally wising up
My own issue is British AIrways is not performing like the national carrier no union jack.etc And would the government actually nationalise and give BA a huge bail out? [:(!] Branson does have a point not to save an industry that is obviously failing.
The problem is the public perception of BA. The arrogance and its history with the dirty tricks campaign, concorde, terminal 5 shambles. All of these don't make me tempted to fly BA and many others for that matter (to 'save' the airline) even with the fantastic sales (granted I have booked all my flights for this year)
On the SRB front he does have a point and although he may have ulterior motives it is a thought that with up to 3 billion pension deficit and only worth 1.65 billion on stock market. What is the board of BA up to? On the shares front the shares do not seem to be suffering that much considering all the speculation on BA's future. Could you imagine it the new worlds favourite airline VBA
IMHO the managers maybe be trying to take advantage to remove the cabin crew and pilots benefits, which they work very hard for and in the end managers want to make cuts so there is more money left even if the airline was profitable I don't see these benefits coming back although 100million saving is small in comparison to 400million in loses!!!!
. I sympathise with them as the money and benefits they and there union has worked hard for is speculated in the evening standard..... Oh wait a minute another strike ES seems to be spewing less hated to those workers! Although it just makes working more difficult with the public, but striking when the airline is on brink of collapse is not a good idea by any union but threat of one is fine keeps the management talking.
I hope BA survives and VS once again proves what its worth and continues to take market share, how would everyone feel with Virgin T5 goodbye galleries and hello Clubhouse...... Virgin would certainly need a new level tier wise and exclusive lounge (like the concorde room) You can dream I suppose [:w]
Just afew thoughts [i]
Alex
My own issue is British AIrways is not performing like the national carrier no union jack.etc And would the government actually nationalise and give BA a huge bail out? [:(!] Branson does have a point not to save an industry that is obviously failing.
The problem is the public perception of BA. The arrogance and its history with the dirty tricks campaign, concorde, terminal 5 shambles. All of these don't make me tempted to fly BA and many others for that matter (to 'save' the airline) even with the fantastic sales (granted I have booked all my flights for this year)
On the SRB front he does have a point and although he may have ulterior motives it is a thought that with up to 3 billion pension deficit and only worth 1.65 billion on stock market. What is the board of BA up to? On the shares front the shares do not seem to be suffering that much considering all the speculation on BA's future. Could you imagine it the new worlds favourite airline VBA
IMHO the managers maybe be trying to take advantage to remove the cabin crew and pilots benefits, which they work very hard for and in the end managers want to make cuts so there is more money left even if the airline was profitable I don't see these benefits coming back although 100million saving is small in comparison to 400million in loses!!!!
. I sympathise with them as the money and benefits they and there union has worked hard for is speculated in the evening standard..... Oh wait a minute another strike ES seems to be spewing less hated to those workers! Although it just makes working more difficult with the public, but striking when the airline is on brink of collapse is not a good idea by any union but threat of one is fine keeps the management talking.
I hope BA survives and VS once again proves what its worth and continues to take market share, how would everyone feel with Virgin T5 goodbye galleries and hello Clubhouse...... Virgin would certainly need a new level tier wise and exclusive lounge (like the concorde room) You can dream I suppose [:w]
Just afew thoughts [i]
Alex
Posted: 22 Jun 2009, 03:33Now,reports that 'OpenSkies', their business-class-only brand, based in Paris and Amsterdam could be sold...
Posted: 22 Jun 2009, 12:26quote:Originally posted by Kraken
BA has to publish annual accounts, drawn up to set standards. Virgin publishes it's accounts in a somewhat more creative manner.
Wrong - BA uses IFRS because it has to (it's listed on a market) and VS uses the older UK accounting principals. It can choose to adopt IFRS but most private companies don't - therefore VS are not being creative they are applying the accounting policies of the vast majority of UK private companies.
If VS applied IFRS, they my have made a loss depending on their fuel hedges but I don't know how effective they were/are forecast to be!
BA has to publish annual accounts, drawn up to set standards. Virgin publishes it's accounts in a somewhat more creative manner.
Wrong - BA uses IFRS because it has to (it's listed on a market) and VS uses the older UK accounting principals. It can choose to adopt IFRS but most private companies don't - therefore VS are not being creative they are applying the accounting policies of the vast majority of UK private companies.
If VS applied IFRS, they my have made a loss depending on their fuel hedges but I don't know how effective they were/are forecast to be!
Posted: 23 Jun 2009, 03:10Today Lord Adonis said he was against bailing out any airlines, but would he really let BA fall as has been said too politcally sensitive.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... l?ITO=1490
Although I do agree with SRB you don't release an internal mail with fight for survival and not expect competition to spin the PR and try to make them look even weaker. Not that it takes much with asking staff to work for free, go part time,
Openskies to potentially go so quickly, but who would actually buy it?
Even with VS 'creative' accounting, I prefer that to applying accounting policies although I do take your point 'flyerdavid' the PR cue alone would probably have meant a surge of business, plus one up on BA. As long as Virgin isn't suffering a 400 million loss we know its safer than some airlines.
Alex
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... l?ITO=1490
Although I do agree with SRB you don't release an internal mail with fight for survival and not expect competition to spin the PR and try to make them look even weaker. Not that it takes much with asking staff to work for free, go part time,
Openskies to potentially go so quickly, but who would actually buy it?
Even with VS 'creative' accounting, I prefer that to applying accounting policies although I do take your point 'flyerdavid' the PR cue alone would probably have meant a surge of business, plus one up on BA. As long as Virgin isn't suffering a 400 million loss we know its safer than some airlines.
Alex