V-Flyer

advice on what to do:

in early August I booked a business miles flight on Air New Zealand using my VS miles from LAX>AKL for January 2010. All seemed ok, and I got a confirmed e-ticket, etc. notified people I was coming, booked rooms, yadda yadda.

months pass.

Now, flight is just a few weeks away, so I start thinking about seats and go to Air NZ to look whats free, and find my ticket booking doesn't show up. I call them up, read them the locator (VS's) - the ticket number, etc. Air NZ can find nothing at all. The booking doesn't exist.

I call Virgin, give them the booking ref, and the (helpful) lady on the phone says, am very sorry but Air New Zealand cancelled that 48hrs after we booked it (!) which is their right, apparently. Trouble is: Nobody told me, so here I am a few weeks away from my scheduled trip with no booking, no reservation, no chance of getting a business miles flight again this close to departure, and no backup plan.

most people would have just turned up at LAX with the e-ticket confirmation I have, but apparently, from what the VS GC helpdesk person (helpful, apologetic, but ultimately unable to do anything) that means nothing, and VS have screwed up in not letting me know it got cancelled 48hrs after I made it back in August.

So here I am speechless at this whole affair. What do I do? - they say they might be able to get me on a flight 5 days earlier - not good for me, (5 days more hotel, 5 days more away from base) or I can just give up and they refund the miles. Or I can BUY a ticket at short notice and pay full price.

This all seems ridiculous - a confirmation is a confirmation, is it not? an e-ticket is a ticket is it not? how can they just randomly pull out of miles tickets after a confirmation + e-ticket have been issued?

what do I do - I'm really annoyed at Virgin, a GC holder, pretty frequent flyer, UC, PE etc, and have just had a dream trip to New Zealand blown apart, and it took me to stumble over the issue, not them.

Any suggestions what to do from here? Scream blue murder? go legal? be nice? apparently I was talking to a senior person already - and they talked to a supervisor at Air NZ, and the best they could offer the earlier flight.

what would you advise?

I have never heard of a reward booking be canceled in this manner. The fact that the booking was canceled and the miles not refunded to your account would annoy me straight away.

Second, I would put it to them this way, nicely of course.

'You messed up, you fix it, i'm a gold card holder, I have shown I am loyal to you, now show you are loyal to me.'

I am gobsmacked for you! I also think you have a clear case to pursue, you forged a contract with VS and by virtue of them not refunding your miles that contract is still in place. They screwed up plane and simple.

It still may not get you anywhere, but I would follow through on this and not simply take it lying down.

As a fall back, have you looked at using miles on V Australia via Sydney?

'plane and simple' ?! nice.

going to try again today. the whole thing sucks:
there were other people flying out from Holland to meet me there. we'd timed our bookings to align at the airport to the hour. all these careful arrangements are screwed up by this.

I dont think I can go via Sydney, as am coming from East Coast USA, not UK. that would turn it into a 24hour+ trip. the normal route here is NYC > LAX then on down-under in a single bearable 12 hour hop.

quote:Originally posted by narikin

I dont think I can go via Sydney, as am coming from East Coast USA, not UK. that would turn it into a 24hour+ trip. the normal route here is NYC > LAX then on down-under in a single bearable 12 hour hop.


V Australia is 'V Australia' not Virgin Atlantic Australia, different airline, flies from LAX to SYD and you can redeem VS miles on flights.

Do you have travel insurance? They might cover you for this scenario.

That's awful, I really hope they get it sorted out for you somehow. I had forgotten about V Australia...but I just checked, and it doesn't look like you can spend VS miles on reward flights with them? It looks like they are only a partner airline you can earn miles on?

not sure if I should push harder on this one or no.

we all know there will be seats free in business on every plane - esp around 8th Jan-ish - well after the hols, its just no miles seats free anymore. (though there were some four months ago when I booked!) If this was AirNZ's screw up they'd release one, but because its VS's screw up, they dont see why they should.

so... I have probably to go 5 days earlier, re-book all connecting flights, shift all my plans, times and pay more hotel days, etc.
incredible mess. VS will owe me big time on this. what should I ask for: 50% refund of miles or some future OpUp?

VS have really let me down on this - despite the booking being 'cancelled' by air NZ within 48hrs, they did not tell me, refund the miles (125,000!) or the money, so it was a 100% valid booking with e-ticket and confirmation, to all purposes.

Did they refund your credit card for the taxes you paid ?

quote:Originally posted by narikin
not sure if I should push harder on this one or no.

we all know there will be seats free in business on every plane - esp around 8th Jan-ish - well after the hols, its just no miles seats free anymore. (though there were some four months ago when I booked!) If this was AirNZ's screw up they'd release one, but because its VS's screw up, they dont see why they should.

so... I have probably to go 5 days earlier, re-book all connecting flights, shift all my plans, times and pay more hotel days, etc.
incredible mess. VS will owe me big time on this. what should I ask for: 50% refund of miles or some future OpUp?

VS have really let me down on this - despite the booking being 'cancelled' by air NZ within 48hrs, they did not tell me, refund the miles (125,000!) or the money, so it was a 100% valid booking with e-ticket and confirmation, to all purposes.



If it is as you say (and I'm not doubting you) then I would push VS all the way on this to get you flying on the original dates. Whether that means they put you on a V Aus flight or whatever, I'd be telling them that's their problem.

As you say, you had an e-ticket issued.

They cancelled it without informing you.

They never refunded miles or any cash so you were unable to twig for yourself that something was up.

I think you're well within your rights to insist VS sort this out and you should push all the way and start asking to speak to someone higher up. They've cocked up and left you in the sh*t. It's just not acceptable, I know I'd be making a nuisance of myself.

I can't believe you have been put through this without VS doing everything possible to remedy the situation. I agree with daywalker it is clearly not acceptable and they must take responsibility .

Believe me, the facts are exactly as I say, and no they have not refunded me the miles or taxes as yet. The miles deduction is still sitting on my account as I write this.

the e-ticket starts like this:

THIS IS YOUR RECEIPT/ITINERARY

Please bring this e-ticket when you check-in.

they say they cannot force Air NZ to release seats, and they are all full now. at least for Rewards tickets... I really dont want to go by V Aus, the Air NZ flight is some 10 HOURS less traveling! Nor has this option even been mentioned /offered, anyway.
am sure there is some small print in the contract that they can point to to get out of this, but any reasonable person understands they utterly screwed up.

Am not an expert on consumer law in the UK let alone the USA but I really think you have a case for non fulfilment of contract.

Is there not a consumer advocacy agency / group you could go to for advice.

Also, a few people seam to put their problems on the VS facebook page and that seams to get them looked at properly. What do others think?

OK - they found a seat ' availability' has re-appeared.
what a fuss. I now have to wait 48hrs to see in AirNZ does not un-confirm it again. keep your fingers crossed!

Nott Nick - hint taken. joining. a first for me in this free Interwebby world.

fyi: I didn't/dont scream and shout. its not who I am. but it got mostly fixed... though I am out of pocket as I have to re-book connecting flights to the new date/ time of return. Not to mention the stress I have had and passed on to my colleagues and our cleverly co-ordinated plans of meeting in Auckland and working + holidaying together.

quote:Originally posted by narikin
OK - they found a seat ' availability' has re-appeared.
what a fuss. I now have to wait 48hrs to see in AirNZ does not un-confirm it again. keep your fingers crossed!


Perhaps someone at VS realized they had screwed up, but congratulations anyway and have a great trip.

I won't join the comments on membership or not (but am sympathetic to Nick, this is not a commercial venture and relies on a lot of people's free time with the support that membership fees bring) - BUT, hope to see you on V-Flyer regularly [y].

Leave this one with me - someone at VS would like to speak to the OP about this.

quote:Originally posted by RichardMannion
Leave this one with me - someone at VS would like to speak to the OP about this.

[^][^][^][^]

quote:Originally posted by Nottingham Nick


You live in the most litigious society on earth (though we are catching up fast [V] ). There only seems one option here - get lawyers involved.
The fact as you have reported them seem as straight forward as they can be and, unless I am missing something, VS have screwed up big style and deserve a kicking - even if this involves buying you full price seats on your original flights.

Nick


quote:Originally posted by tontybear
Am not an expert on consumer law in the UK let alone the USA but I really think you have a case for non fulfilment of contract.

Is there not a consumer advocacy agency / group you could go to for advice.



While laying in bed I wondered about this, many states now have pretty strong consumer advocacy people, I just have no idea how it would relate in this case.

Scrooge

I was thinking that they would know the applicable consumer rights laws and point the OP to some clause or other regarding unfulfilled contracts etc that he could waive at VS to get them to sort this out for him.

Would rather do this than call in m'learned friends who would just get all macho with each other!

TB, I would agree with you, however you would be amazed at how badly companies manage the various state laws out here, while chances are you are right it is always worth checking with the state first.

Also, with the funds (miles and money) being with held by VS this there could actually be federal implications, I think, before I go any further with that line of thought I need caffeine and to brush up on my RICO laws.

Oh my god ... unbelievable! Mind you I have been in a similar-ish situation myself ... except I didn't find out until we got to checkin! And that was on a BA FIRST flight booked in a super discounted Expedia rate. Expedia hadn't issued an e-ticket number or something so I wasn't boarding. And there was no way they would let me on until they had that number (they had my booking and seat selection). Fortunately we were in F and it seemed half the check-in and ticketing desk were phoning around everyone they could to get is resolved. Fortunately Expedia's call centre opened at 7:00am (it was something like a 9:30am flight) and we were able to get it resolved.

Glad that you have your seat ... and hopefully it stays that way. Please let us know how it goes.

Mat

all seems settled apart that I have to now re-book my flight connections to get to LAX, and am unable to get the same class of Reward flights on AA that I had booked months ago. VS did drop the ball hard on this one, but they tried to play catch up soon after, and have managed to make a very close replacement booking luckily.

be warned though: double check your reward flights with the partner airline directly, and do not trust VS e-ticket partner 'confirmations'!

In an attempt to keep this thread on topic, I have split off the debate about my view that people who have 50+ posts should join the site to this new thread in the V-Flyer website area of the site.

Feel free to post views about site membership there, and comments about the cancellation of narikin's reward flight in this thread.

Thanks

Nick