V-Flyer

Looks like G-VSHY, G-VMEG, G-VOGE and G-VFOX will all be off from July. Guessing these frames were on a 10 year lease which is due to expire. G-VSHY was the 1st A346 delivered worldwide in July 2002 and is available from July 2012. Cant remember dates any of the others entered service.

Maybe we will see the next A333 delivered around this time?

http://www.airbus.com/aircraftfamilies/ ... available/

Hope VS has some good replacements lined up - wold not be good to loose a chunk of the fleet as the Olympics start n(

buns

Interesting ... and a little sad ... 8 A333s are due this year from approx April. 5 new from Airbus and 3 on short term lease

Sad to see such young aircraft being retired, particularly as they have very limited second hand value. Perhaps Iberia or LH might snap them up.

Can't understand why the 747's and A343's are remaining instead of these 4 aircraft though.

However the A333's will do mid haul routes like BOS, IAD, ORD, NYC and DXB much more efficiently than the A346.

Looks as though VS is aiming for a predominantly A333 and B787 fleet in 5 years time, supplemented by any remaining 747's probably plying the leisure routes. Can't see the A380's ever materialising.

VS fleet planning is one of life's mysteries!

clarkeysntfc wrote:Sad to see such young aircraft being retired, particularly as they have very limited second hand value. Perhaps Iberia or LH might snap them up.

Being as these aircraft are leased and are seemingly at the end of them then their resale value really isn't going to be a concern of VS... unless they were able to negotiate a much lower leasing rate to renew the lease would possibly have made it more attractive for VS to do so if they had!

I certainly hope VS knows what it is doing, replacing these with smaller aircraft even if they do actually come might be more economical, but is it good business? And why retire these before the remainder of the A343s which are more uneconomical?

clarkeysntfc wrote:Sad to see such young aircraft being retired, particularly as they have very limited second hand value. Perhaps Iberia or LH might snap them up.

Can't understand why the 747's and A343's are remaining instead of these 4 aircraft though.

However the A333's will do mid haul routes like BOS, IAD, ORD, NYC and DXB much more efficiently than the A346.

Looks as though VS is aiming for a predominantly A333 and B787 fleet in 5 years time, supplemented by any remaining 747's probably plying the leisure routes. Can't see the A380's ever materialising.

VS fleet planning is one of life's mysteries!

I think the A380 will turn up eventually, it is not due for a few years yet is it? RE the A380 was it VS who have the aspiration to fly one of their A380 routes of london to Perth (Aus) direct?

Also, with no new UCS announced, does this mean two class A333s flying from LHR? That would spell disaster and downturn ... VS going the way of BD perhaps through mismanagement?

slinky09 wrote:Also, with no new UCS announced, does this mean two class A333s flying from LHR? That would spell disaster and downturn ... VS going the way of BD perhaps through mismanagement?

The new UCS has been certified

All A330 deliveries this year will have the new UCS... though we have not yet been told what it is - just that it is coming! Not long to wait though as the first 2012 333 arrives in March. I've also heard the 2 x leisure 333's will also be reconfigured and come back to LHR once the leisure 747 refit is complete.

With the 4x A346's going back, I think we have finally worked out where the A333's are going to fit in. With another 2x A343's going back this year, there would have been 8x planes leaving the fleet ready for the A333 to drop straight in.

Slinky, I can't imagine that VS will not run a dual cabin from LHR. If you look at the PE cabin in the A333, it looks suspiciously like the UC cabin (with the central overhead lockers missing) and I thought it always looked like thats where the UC seats would end up going. Hopefully we'll know soon enough!

ComeFlyWithV wrote:

slinky09 wrote:Also, with no new UCS announced, does this mean two class A333s flying from LHR? That would spell disaster and downturn ... VS going the way of BD perhaps through mismanagement?

The new UCS has been certified

All A330 deliveries this year will have the new UCS... though we have not yet been told what it is - just that it is coming! Not long to wait though as the first 2012 333 arrives in March. I've also heard the 2 x leisure 333's will also be reconfigured and come back to LHR once the leisure 747 refit is complete.

Hurrah.

back to 747's only for MAN then?

slinky09 wrote:I certainly hope VS knows what it is doing, replacing these with smaller aircraft even if they do actually come might be more economical, but is it good business? And why retire these before the remainder of the A343s which are more uneconomical?

I think one of the reasons for keeping the A343's might be that they're fully paid for, so even if they're less efficient to fly they don't cost as much as the A346's due to no outstanding finance.

In terms of capacity, the A333's are roughly 250 seaters in 3 class formation. I'd expect to see a config similar to Air Canada's as they use the herringbone J seat.

http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/a330-300.html

Compared to the A346's that's going to be a cut of around 70 seats per aircraft. Quite strange.

clarkeysntfc wrote:In terms of capacity, the A333's are roughly 250 seaters in 3 class formation. I'd expect to see a config similar to Air Canada's as they use the herringbone J seat.

http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/a330-300.html

Compared to the A346's that's going to be a cut of around 70 seats per aircraft. Quite strange.

The link shows 2 class at a total of 265 with 8 seats per economy row, if they stick in some premium rows and take out economy seats, it looks a very small replacement for the "mines is longer than yours" A340-600's. ?|

Good to hear that the new UCS's on its way y)

Maybe the A380's will fit in some way to bolster the capacity that is being lost.

David

not a fan of the 330s, the reveiws have not been great in relataion to leg room which for me is a key factor. and if UC is beyond my reach PE doesnt seem as good as the bubble.

so if i cant get a 747 maybe time to look elsewhere....even AA with their new look(As per clarkeys post)

David wrote:Maybe the A380's will fit in some way to bolster the capacity that is being lost.

I'm struggling to see where the 380 fits in to the VS route network. The only routes where I can see the capacity being a benefit are:
- SFO, perhaps 1 daily A380 instead of 1 747 + 1 A343
- MCO, school holidays
- JNB, in the southern summer
- HKG, but what to do about the SYD tag-on.

And don't forget one 747-400 g-vrom is returning to the fleet so extra capacity there

One of the reasons I've always picked VS over other long haul airlines is their use of 4-engined planes.

We met a Virgin pilot on hols in Antigua years ago who recommended avoiding long 'oversea' routes on planes with 2 engines. He had some stories that timid fliers would not want to hear!! :0

I remember a very scary flight from EWR to BHX on a Continental 757 a few years ago that I would not want to repeat.

Despite their age 747s still my favourite, particulary up front in zone A!

A 747, G-VTOP is leaving next year.

clarkeysntfc wrote:

slinky09 wrote:In terms of capacity, the A333's are roughly 250 seaters in 3 class formation. I'd expect to see a config similar to Air Canada's as they use the herringbone J seat.

http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/a330-300.html

Compared to the A346's that's going to be a cut of around 70 seats per aircraft. Quite strange.

The A330's are the same size as the A340-300's (well within an inch or two of each other!) so would expect to see a config pretty similar to what's on the A340-300's at the moment (unless they chose to have a smaller UC cabin by doing away with the little mini cabin behind the 2nd set of doors and increase the PE cabin, but would mean quite a loss of UC seats over the 346's that they'll be replacing if that happens!)

And also I'm always lead to believe that VS does well with cargo, but the A333 has significantly less cargo capacity and payload than a A346 ... weird downsizing! I am getting worried by VS.

slinky09 wrote:And also I'm always lead to believe that VS does well with cargo, but the A333 has significantly less cargo capacity and payload than a A346 ... weird downsizing! I am getting worried by VS.

162m3 vs 206m3 -22% less.....I would have hoped that they looked at the complete picture....perhaps the shorter routes (3800 km shorter range) they will use it on are less cargo intensive...

and maybe, just maybe, they know how to run an airline better than us

It should give Virgin a more versatile fleet for seasonal demand on routes. Its not the first time they have introduced smaller planes i.e. a 747 fleet to a mixed 747/A343.

It seems to me that a number of airlines are flying smaller planes these days inc BA: 747-400 to 777

slinky09 wrote:And also I'm always lead to believe that VS does well with cargo, but the A333 has significantly less cargo capacity and payload than a A346 ... weird downsizing! I am getting worried by VS.

Not accoring to this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A340-600#A340-600 - 152.3 cubic metres (5380 cubic ft)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbus_A330 - 162.8 cubic metres (5750 cubic ft)

OK, weight is an entirely separate measure.

slinky09 wrote:And also I'm always lead to believe that VS does well with cargo, but the A333 has significantly less cargo capacity and payload than a A346 ... weird downsizing! I am getting worried by VS.

Don't forget the new A330's do not have ANY proper crew rest facilities... so that means there is extra space in the hold that can be used for Cargo (as the 346 has the lower deck mobile crew rest).