V-Flyer

I just wanted to know peoples opinion on the following:

In my opinion seats on any aircraft should not be able to recline. I have 2 flight over the last week where the people in front of me reclined their seat as soon as they could . As a result of this I could not see anything on the TV screen at all. I know this is probably a design fault on the TV however I just think if the seats didn't reclined it would make for a better flight experience. I know Monarch have said they are not going to fit seats that recline from now on and for me every airline should adopt this.

Short haul with no recline is acceptable.
Long haul with no recline is not acceptable and I wouldn't travel with that airline!

Agree with Ultreen1, recline is essential on long haul. The main problem is the abysmal seat pitch in economy cabins. Would definitely benefit from banning any recline during meal service though. I think most people do this anyway but there's always the one who doesn't.

I saw this posted on an Orlando forum on FB as well, most seemed in favour of banning the recline.

Personally I think it's needed on long haul but as others say not during meal service and i normally say to the person behind before I recline, good manners go far.

Purely talking about VS here I flew with mrs b to JFK in PE once and the people in front didn't recline so we didn't ,IMO there is a lot more room if both rows don't recline in PE on VS

What is this reclining seat you speak of? I have not seen one for some time...

Joking aside, I agree with thoughts that recline on long haul is good to have, but not during meal service, and with due consideration for the person sat behind you. No recline on short haul is fine, but on long flights the ability to recline just a couple of inches encourages relaxation IMO.

I'am with Ultreen too, long haul you need to be able to relax. I was sat next to a chap on a DL flight from JFK - ORD who was fixing some kind of device to his tray table, the person in front was unable to recline but I think he thought it was a faulty seat and moved. I asked the chap and he showed me the gadget http://www.kneedefender.com/html2/how_to.htm

Not sure it's ethical but it works, don't think I could be so bold as to prevent another
PAX from reclining.

Thanks

flyingfox wrote:I'am with Ultreen too, long haul you need to be able to relax. I was sat next to a chap on a DL flight from JFK - ORD who was fixing some kind of device to his tray table, the person in front was unable to recline but I think he thought it was a faulty seat and moved. I asked the chap and he showed me the gadget http://www.kneedefender.com/html2/how_to.htm

Not sure it's ethical but it works, don't think I could be so bold as to prevent another
PAX from reclining.

Thanks

Interesting gadget, but I'm not sure it's ethical either. Also I think if you were caught with such a device it might be considered that you're tampering with the aircraft equipment and that could be interpreted as endangering other pax. I know that's an extreme interpretation, but god knows the airlines have told us for years that electronic devices may interfere with aircraft systems during take of and landing, and if that were really true then why wouldn't they interfere during the rest of the flight? Anyway, the point is that's what they tell us and CC are instructed to get pax to switch off, and some are very militant about it. Imagine if they caught a pax attaching a device to the aircraft fixtures and fittings?

Travelling in PE to Orlando a couple of years back I had a nasty experience when the passenger in front reclined her seat just after take off. I had placed my bottle of water on the tray table and she reclined with such force the bottle shot back into my lap. A cabin crew member saw this happened and politely asked the woman to move her seat back until after the meal service. She refused!!! However I then decided to change seats with my 6year old grandson and told him to forget all we had said about not accidently kicking the seat in front.

I think that the 'Knee Defender' has been around for some time and remember it, or something similar, being featured on a US news programme years ago.
The real problem, as we all know, is the airlines obsession with getting more sardines in the tin!
Ethically are those few inches your space or designed to be included in recline parameters of the seat in front? Difficult to know, perhaps the European Court of Justice could decide?

Was kinda thinking along the same lines as hazban on this.
The seat pitch and the recline are published figures so perhaps they do make up part of the per pax area each pax is paying for. Unless there is a CAA / FAA regulation perhaps airlines cannot stop you reclining(????)
Anyway, lets not start the no recline seats pitch (do you get it ) I am sure if VS get sniff of this they could get another few rows with no seat recline

Coming back from Thailand we had 2 guys who reclined straight away and ate their meals reclined, it doesn't bother me as I'm not 6ft like simon. Simon gets very angry, so I get angry for him! The TV screens were touch screen on that flight...or thud screen as I like to call them in those situations!
Serves our right for flying Y!

It wouldn't bother me about Banning reclining on short haul but I want it on long haul. I always recline on long haul night flights as I want to get some sleep. But I always sit up at meal times.

Recline on a long haul is a must have.
Flat bed is better though.
What bothers me more is a screen tapper behind me.
On our last flight we got the back row in PE so we didn't have anyone behind. No screen tappers and no one to upset when we reclined. Which I do pretty much as soon as I can.

Dick D

It's so much a matter of people being considerate which mostly they are but we have had two flights in PE to/from EWR where those in front have fully reclined immediately and stayed that way for the entire flight including meal. Each time made it impossible for us to eat, watch TV, and very difficult to get out of the seat, particularly the one by the window. I've no problem with those reclining part-way, but full recline on a daytime flight is just inconsiderate IMO.

If a seat is advertised as having a recline then the person using it has a right to do just that. If people are ignorant and refuse to sit upright during meals it says something about them not the seat or airline.
Fitting restrainers to another persons seat is just as priggish in my view as someone reclining at innapropriate times.

I guess it's just part of the economy 'experience'

I get more (internally) angry at the seat back grabbers.. the people in the row behind that feel the need to use the head rest of the seat in front to hang on to, in order to stand up. Particularly bad if you are on the aisle seat, that everyone loves to grab on to.

Have you noticed how aisle seats tend to have wobbly-backs, thanks to all the surprisingly many pax who are unable to stand up without support.

Personally I always try and sit at the very back so that I can have a 'Righteous Recline'

I've patented a method of 'Mutually Assured Discomfort' sitting position for rude recliners.

Note: You can usually spot the 'Rude Recliner' from the following pre-take off observations

- Asking for drink before plane has taken off (High Risk)
- Reclining seat before take off
- Attempting to use priority boarding without priory ticket (The worst)

Mutually Assured Discomfort: Instructions


1) Sit slightly sideways with your bottom as far forwards as possible
2) With one knee slightly in front of the other position yourself upon take off
3) As soon as you detect movement slide your bum towards the seat. This will make them think the seats all the way back but really its resting on your knee!

A knee in the back should make them move forwards.. if not goto step 4

4) Wait for them to fall asleep and whip out your knee jolting them awake propelling the seat back then forwards again as it didn't lock
5) Replace your knee into position and see if they dare do it again!

....True its not exactly comfortable and yes you could probably just ask them to move forwards...but boy do you feel better inside

mikeijay wrote:I've patented a method of 'Mutually Assured Discomfort' sitting position for rude recliners.

Been doing this for years myself without calling it that. Being rather long-legged (6'3-4 but with longer legs than average build), on some carriers there is no option but to do this. Delta is particularly bad on some seats for this, but the cabin crew/check-in staff there are more friendly than American and often take pity on me and allocate a more appropriate seating location.

McCoy wrote:I get more (internally) angry at the seat back grabbers.. the people in the row behind that feel the need to use the head rest of the seat in front to hang on to, in order to stand up. Particularly bad if you are on the aisle seat, that everyone loves to grab on to.

^^ agree with this. It is incredibly disruptive.

In response to the main question of this thread, the answer is shell seats, but are any of them comfortable?

at240 wrote:

McCoy wrote:I get more (internally) angry at the seat back grabbers.. the people in the row behind that feel the need to use the head rest of the seat in front to hang on to, in order to stand up. Particularly bad if you are on the aisle seat, that everyone loves to grab on to.

^^ agree with this. It is incredibly disruptive.

In response to the main question of this thread, the answer is shell seats, but are any of them comfortable?

Some of us are old and have mobility issues and, much as we dislike grabbing the seat in front to get up because the person in front gets annoyed, we cannot avoid it. I personally rejoice when I am on a short-haul flight and there is no-one in the seat in front. I do apologise, however, to whoever is there and I apologise in advance to you, McCoy, should I have the misfortune to be seated in the row behind you.

I think we both know that people who physically cannot stand up from a chair without holding on to something forms a small proportion of the seat grabbers.

I find seating grabbing is a very effective way of dealer with a serial recliner.

I think reclining is fine as long as it is done at appropriate times, and especially not during the meal service, which to be fair I think the crew should automatically resolve if seen without the need for input from the affected pax.

The recliners I really hate are young kids who gain no benefit from it and do it just because they can (see my 2008 MCO TR!)