V-Flyer

I thought this discussion in the "G-VBIG" thread warranted its own thread, as from April there'll be major changes to crewing and service on VS flights that'll affect passengers in all cabins.

This post from that thread explains all:

vscss wrote:I'm afraid to say BIG changes are on the way to ALL cabins from 1st April 2016:

1. No more senior cabin crew rank, so anyone can work in Upper Class. (Currently you are promoted to senior and go through a 5 day training course at the training facility, this will now be a quick online course!!)
2. Loosing up to 2 crew from each aircraft, most notably the Upper Class cabin supervisor.
3. No dedicated crew in Premium cabin, crew from economy will start in Premium & work straight through to economy, so you may be sitting with your meal tray in front of you for sometime!!
4. Extended graze items inc afternoon tea will be available in Upper class until 90 mins before landing, after which the Upper class service will stop as crew needed to help elsewhere.
5. With the reduction of crew, good luck even getting served a drink at the bar, never mind the crew having time to stop and chat to passengers!
6. Upper class ice creams have gone, spare back up Premium meals have gone & Upper class hot meal ratios have also been reduced.

Given Craig Kreeger's assurance last year that passengers wouldn't be affected by his cost savings, I can only assume Delta are turning the screw and sadly it seems the one area where VS really stands out over its rivals - that "sparkle" provided by its cabin crew - is about to be sacrificed.

I will reserve judgement until I have seen this new "enhanced" service in action - Don't imagine they will be nice things that I'll be saying though... the kind of things I can't say when the vicar is around.

If we could pre-book our meal choices this will solve a lot of the UC meal ratio issues and speed up the service as there would be no need to round the cabin asking what you want.

Trailed already in this thread from last November.

Wonderful, sets me up nicely for my UC flight on the 7th April... Hopefully the LGW CH will at least still be open!

vscss wrote:4. Extended graze items inc afternoon tea will be available in Upper class until 90 mins before landing, after which the Upper class service will stop as crew needed to help elsewhere.

Thats mad! I have always though VS have ended service and cleared in very early. You get a 40 minute "warning" on BA and crew clear away at 20 minutes to landing.

Also will be sad to see the ice cream go on VS, though do prefer the Dulce de Leche ice cream in the Club Kitchen.

I was confused about the loss of ice cream. I've never had one in 3 years of UC, did I sleep through it or do you have to ask?

I did, however, have a choc-ice every time I was in PE.

stuart_f wrote:I was confused about the loss of ice cream. I've never had one in 3 years of UC, did I sleep through it or do you have to ask?

I did, however, have a choc-ice every time I was in PE.

Handed out ex-LHR between main meal and second meal (& possibly other routes too), it's just a little tub.

and this is in the wake of the lowest fuel prices in over a decade and having been checking for the last 4 weeks the highest sale prices too!

I think pre-ordering the food would be great also.

I've only been fortunate to be in UC 3 times, and each time after I'd ordered, they came back to ask if I would mind changing to something else. Looks unprofessional.

Also, no ice-cream. No big deal I guess, but really, how much can 20 tubs of ice cream cost per flight for the UC passengers?

Seems like a race to the bottom.

It will be interesting to with 2 crew less onboard at the same time as getting rid of the SCC rank.
Whilst those in crawley towers believe these changes won't effect NPS as customers don't value the service from SCC or dedicated crew in premium economy. Yeah right! Apparently customers don't even value getting their meal choice as it won't effect them rebooking with the airline. Sign of things to come.

Just to give a different view, I don't like the idea of reserving meals in advance ... I like perusing the menu on-board and choosing what I feel like there and then. I don't know how hungry I'll be or what exactly I'll feel like in advance!

I've also found the ice cream service strange ... always had ice cream service in EC/PE but I don't think I've ever been offered one on any of my many UC flights!

oceanscape wrote:Just to give a different view, I don't like the idea of reserving meals in advance ... I like perusing the menu on-board and choosing what I feel like there and then. I don't know how hungry I'll be or what exactly I'll feel like in advance!

I've also found the ice cream service strange ... always had ice cream service in EC/PE but I don't think I've ever been offered one on any of my many UC flights!

I agree with about choosing meals in advance. I hate having to pre-order food, and in terms of practicality I'm not sure it would be that feasible. There are many pax who book last minute, or upgrade at the airport, so there will always have to be some spare choices loaded and that inevitably would mean that some pax still don't get their number 1 meal choice. This is a much discussed topic, but unless they load one of every choice for each pax, which is totally unrealistic, there is always a chance someone won't get what they want. The removal of the ice cream is no loss at all for me. I'm either asleep or I get it, not really wanting it as I am still full from the main meal service and end up leaving most of it.

I'm very much in the camp of wait and see before declaring how dreadful everything is going to be. On the face of it, loosing two crew members isn't good, especially during the busiest times.

I personally don't mind loosing the 'dedicated' PE crew. On the LGW/MAN 747's upstairs the crew work both PE and Y and having sat in both cabins recently it works fine.

Also, the fact any crew would not be allowed to work Upper, I don't think is all bad. We've had some brilliant UC crew, but some dreadful ones too, and the same in Y/PE, so maybe it will allow some of the 'stars' that help make Virgin what it is, to work in UC when they currently don't get the chance. You can have every training course in the world, but the best way to know how to work in UC, is to actually do it. Providing they have a strong FSM, the level of service from the crew offered in UC shouldn't suffer.

Ultimately we all have a choice, and if the changes do dramatically impact the service we can all choose to fly another carrier, but at least by VS hopefully being in profit and making money, they will be around for us to choose not to fly them rather than them not even being an option at all.

As I get older my memory gets worse. Example; I can't actually say whether or not I have been offered an ice cream on any flight.
With meals I've read the menu and ordered. By the time the meal comes I'm not certain what I ordered. So pre-ordering isn't going to make a great deal of difference to me. I usually go for the chicken as it's in a white sauce and less likely to stain when I spill it.
My main worry is not ice cream or grazing options, but a grumpy crew who have now got more work to do for less money.
Like many I fly Virgin because it's upbeat and friendly. Keep it that way and I'll be happy.
Dick D

And for Joey's campaign, I'll make sure I use the bar on my upcoming flight.

Neil wrote:There are many pax who book last minute, or upgrade at the airport, so there will always have to be some spare choices loaded and that inevitably would mean that some pax still don't get their number 1 meal choice.

I'm led to believe at the moment in UC they load about 130% of required meals, so in a cabin of 30 seats there'll be about 10 spare to allow for choice. That, I'm told, is going down to 110% so there'll be only about 3 spare. Meaning if you're not in the front few rows it'll be pot luck as to whether you get your first choice.

In PE I gather there'll be no spare meals at all.

Wow... cost cutting at its worst. Especially with the massive fuel cost savings.

You'd have thought with oil prices as low as they are they'd be more margin these days with the YQ surcharges still as high as they are.

I'm travelling UC every month from Feb to June so far with a LAX flight April it will be interesting to see what impact these changes have.

My last 5 outgoing flights to MCO have all been in UC . Without exception the cc service have made each journey a pleasure. Had to settle for second choice on 2 flights. One flight I had nothing else to eat after 1st choice not available and other options no good for me. Offered a PE meal instead. Reducing staff levels will affect service levels even with cc working harder. Given the price of an UC ticket I do not think it unreasonable to expect a 1st choice meal. The cc start meal service front to back (unless you are gold and you get asked first) so our upcoming trip in 10/11k means less chance of a 1st choice? In the scheme of things do these changes really save that much money and surely it must lead o diminishing returns as I'm sure they won't stop anytime soon.

oceanscape wrote:Just to give a different view, I don't like the idea of reserving meals in advance ... I like perusing the menu on-board and choosing what I feel like there and then. I don't know how hungry I'll be or what exactly I'll feel like in advance!

You can pre-order you main course on BA, or you can wait until the flight, pre-ordering on BA has drastically reduced the number of people being unhappy with not getting their choice (not eliminated it), it also enables BA to save on wasted meals without effecting the customer.

Traveller wrote:Given the price of an UC ticket I do not think it unreasonable to expect a 1st choice meal. The cc start meal service front to back (unless you are gold and you get asked first) so our upcoming trip in 10/11k means less chance of a 1st choice? In the scheme of things do these changes really save that much money and surely it must lead o diminishing returns as I'm sure they won't stop anytime soon.

The crew should take all orders, then work out how many people to ask to change option, should be done regarding FC status.

"The crew should take all orders, then work out how many people to ask to change option, should be done regarding FC status."

That's interesting, they take all the orders then choices prioritised by status so we might be in with a chance of a first choice. Thanks for the info

I don't think they always start from the front.
Last year we had our favorite seats, 6A & 6K out of Gatwick and Mrs D in 6A was told they had run out of the crayfish starter. I had also ordered it and mine was going to be delivered until Mrs D volunteered me to swap and she got the starter and I got 4000 miles and gnocchi.
Dick D

They take orders from the front but as mentioned above they should then prioritise them back in the galley so UNIQ/Gold/Silver/everyone else starting at the front.

gumshoe wrote:They take orders from the front but as mentioned above they should then prioritise them back in the galley so UNIQ/Gold/Silver/everyone else starting at the front.

That would explain why Mrs D as a red Flying Club member got told they'd run out when I got offered mine as a Silver FC member. Sadly even silver will disappear this year so I guess next year I will be very pleased if pre-ordering comes in.

Thanks for explaining Gumshoe.

Dick D

As pjh has stated, this was flagged up late last year.

On my most recent flight, I discussed this with the FSM and with a degree of resigned certainty, he said that crews will do their best to make the situation work.

At the crux of all this is many senior members of crew are effectively being demoted and nobody can be certain as to how individuals will cope this demotivating course of action by management upon them.

Something I think we have all experienced is how dedicated so many crew members are and time will tell how this good will can last before truly good crew vote with their feet.

I for one will not be taking out any diminution of service on the crew, but will make any feelings known to Crawley Towers and Mr K

buns

buns wrote:Something I think we have all experienced is how dedicated so many crew members are and time will tell how this good will can last before truly good crew vote with their feet.

I believe quite a few have decided to take redundancy and will leave end of March.