For all non-Virgin travel topics, with subforums for popular common themes.
#952305 by Sealink
22 Sep 2019, 23:57
It seems the inevitable has happened.
Feel for the staff.
Losing a holiday isn't necessarily the end of the world, but losing a job can be devastating.


https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 16031.html
#952311 by VS075
23 Sep 2019, 09:34
My thoughts are with all the staff across the entire group, none of this is their fault. I hope they all find new jobs very soon and hope nobody is stranded abroad for too long.
#952315 by Fuzzy14
23 Sep 2019, 09:50
Short term the holidaymakers will complain, they'lll all get home or thereabouts within reasonable time. They'll have a story for the future.
Full of admiration for the TCX team, planes took off last night and they knew they'd be out of a job when they landed. Hope they find something soon.
Short haul slack will be taken up by Jet2, EasyJet etc
My big question is what's happening to the long haul that Virgin considered purchasing? Huge opportunity here but they'll have to move quick.
#952316 by Dobbo
23 Sep 2019, 11:06
A very sad day for those in the industry, in particular those employees who have lost their jobs.

However, life moves on and it is important that what can be salvaged is salvaged quickly.

There is opportunity out there. Opportunity for VS to expand to fill the void at MAN (at least in part) which in turn presents opportunity for ex-TCX staff to quickly find replacement employment.

If VS were ever serious about buying part of TCX, the time to act has arrived and I hope they do so promptly.
#952318 by VS075
23 Sep 2019, 11:43
Dobbo wrote:A very sad day for those in the industry, in particular those employees who have lost their jobs.

However, life moves on and it is important that what can be salvaged is salvaged quickly.

There is opportunity out there. Opportunity for VS to expand to fill the void at MAN (at least in part) which in turn presents opportunity for ex-TCX staff to quickly find replacement employment.

If VS were ever serious about buying part of TCX, the time to act has arrived and I hope they do so promptly.


I think any expansion will just be done by using what they've got (i.e. existing/additional aircraft) instead of purchasing an airline which will come with things VS may not want. Like I said recently, now Thomas Cook is sadly no more they're better off just cherry picking the things they want rather than take the whole lot. There's also the risk of a bidding war if there are other prospective suitors in the frame.
#952319 by tontybear
23 Sep 2019, 12:14
Whether VS can pick up any of the pieces of Thomas Cook will depend on what the administrators offer for sale - planes / slots etc and the price they want for them and who else might be intersted. If they can sell it on as a single company then they will but if they split it off into different units then there may be opportunities for VS and others

I've seen suggestions on flyer talk from the arm chair chief execs hat IAG might want the LGW slots but they still havn't fully incorporated the Monarch slots they got when they colapsed and don't have the planes (or staff) to operate new flights either and that applies to the whole IAG family not just BA.

It seams most of the planes were leased rather than owned for example.

As to the staff a friend of mine was TC cabin crew. They have been aware of the possibility of this happening for some time. Last week he was told they wouldn't be keeping him on over the winter (but in the last 4 years he's only worked one winter so that wasn't connected to the current issues).

Last night he was ironing his shirts with the expectation he'd be flying today ...


What really gets my goat is some of the selfish whinging I've seen on the news from some passengers who expect things to be sorted out immediatly.
#952320 by gumshoe
23 Sep 2019, 12:50
There isn’t an airline to purchase any more. The planes, presumably, will go back to their lessors and most of the staff, sadly, have been told they’re being made redundant.

It’s not like VS can just swoop in, take over the airline, pay off its debts and carry on as if nothing has happened.

The slots are probably the most valuable asset now, and I’d expect a battle for those.
#952322 by LREDI
23 Sep 2019, 13:12
Indeed as TC has entered liquidation they’ll need to sell everything they can. Planes will he returned to lessors. Slots will be sold.

My thinking is that VS may look to see how they can sweat their assets that bit more in 2020 with some frequency increases. Apart from that, I wouldn’t expect much. Bear in mind the 787s are back to full capacity (nearly) and more 350s due also 4 extra 332s in the fleet. Can’t see VS wanting to take any of the TC 332s given the extra cost of cabin refits is etc when they have neos on the way.
#952323 by tontybear
23 Sep 2019, 13:38
gumshoe wrote:
The slots are probably the most valuable asset now, and I’d expect a battle for those.


Yes indeed but it depends on who actually owns the slots.

If they were leased they will go back to the airline that owned them (e.g. the VS slot leased to Cobalt that was retuned to them then Cobalt when bust and being used this summer for a flybe Guernsey to LHR flight) but that will result in a scramble to lease them again so as to avoid the 80-20 use or lose it rule.


If TC owned them then yes they will be sold
#952324 by getinjonathan
23 Sep 2019, 14:13
Very very sad indeed.

From a business standpoint, this could be an incredible opportunity for VS with the Atlantic routes with plenty of slots now up for grabs at both MAN and LGW. I'm quite sure there is a plan of action in place, but getting people back home safely is obviously the priority right now.
#952325 by Dobbo
23 Sep 2019, 14:35
VS075 wrote:
Dobbo wrote:A very sad day for those in the industry, in particular those employees who have lost their jobs.

However, life moves on and it is important that what can be salvaged is salvaged quickly.

There is opportunity out there. Opportunity for VS to expand to fill the void at MAN (at least in part) which in turn presents opportunity for ex-TCX staff to quickly find replacement employment.

If VS were ever serious about buying part of TCX, the time to act has arrived and I hope they do so promptly.


I think any expansion will just be done by using what they've got (i.e. existing/additional aircraft) instead of purchasing an airline which will come with things VS may not want. Like I said recently, now Thomas Cook is sadly no more they're better off just cherry picking the things they want rather than take the whole lot. There's also the risk of a bidding war if there are other prospective suitors in the frame.


Apologies - my post was not clear.

I’m advocating that VS consider backfill via a combination of: (1) what they already have; and (2) what assets they might be able to pick up from the ashes of TCX or elsewhere (this includes staff as well as aircraft etc.).
#952329 by VS075
23 Sep 2019, 16:10
tontybear wrote:What really gets my goat is some of the selfish whinging I've seen on the news from some passengers who expect things to be sorted out immediatly.


It sucks if you've had your dream holiday ruined or are stranded, but that's nothing compared to the thousands who are now out of work and have mortgages and bills to pay, mouths to feed etc. It's probably also stressful for the consulate staff at destinations who were dispatched to the airports this morning to help those originally scheduled to fly today onto repatriation flights.

I hope your friend finds a new job very soon.

gumshoe wrote:The slots are probably the most valuable asset now, and I’d expect a battle for those.


Absolutely - particularly some of the early-morning slots at places such as MAN and LGW which will no doubt be fought over by the likes of easyJet, Jet2, Ryanair, TUI etc.

LREDI wrote:Can’t see VS wanting to take any of the TC 332s given the extra cost of cabin refits is etc when they have neos on the way.


Three of the A330's were first delivered in 1999 to Airtours, stayed on when they rebranded to MyTravel and later kept on when they merged with Thomas Cook. They weren't exclusively used on long-haul duties as all three operators sent them on some of the busier short-haul routes. One of them is ex-BMI and not that much younger.

I suppose it will boil down to how many hours/cycles they're on and how long they've got before they're due major maintenance such as a D-Check whether they find new homes. I recall one of the ex-BMI A330's being scrapped at Sanford after BA dispensed with them post-merger. It will be down to the leaseco to make that call, but if they're in decent nick and in light of the ongoing 787 RR engine issues they could come in useful for some airlines.
#952330 by RLF
23 Sep 2019, 16:23
If Virgin get some of these slots could we see the 346’ssurvive a little longer. At least they are branded and known to virgin crews?
#952331 by Dobbo
23 Sep 2019, 16:25
RLF wrote:If Virgin get some of these slots could we see the 346’ssurvive a little longer. At least they are branded and known to virgin crews?


I had wondered if a stay of execution for some of the A346 and/or B744 fleet might be in order to bridge the gap pending delivery of the A35K and A339 fleet...
#952332 by AJC
23 Sep 2019, 17:31
tontybear wrote:What really gets my goat is some of the selfish whinging I've seen on the news from some passengers who expect things to be sorted out immediatly.


Hear hear. I'm in a couple of FB groups and dear Lord, you've never heard anything like it. And the worst is people are actually calling for boycotts on other airlines, Virgin included because they're not seeing the same fares they had booked with TC, and that fares have shot up since the announcement, and they're accusing them of deliberately jacking up the prices. Never mind that thousands are trying to rebook at short notice.... they still expect virgin to offer fares are 300pp going next week. SMH.
#952333 by VS075
23 Sep 2019, 18:57
Just seen on Instagram that VS are recruiting Thomas Cook cabin crew that were caught up in today’s collapse via a dedicated portal which is open for one week.
#952340 by CCFD1013
24 Sep 2019, 05:24
It really annoys me how Thomas Cook passengers have turned on Virgin Atlantic. Agree with AJC on Facebook you see people whinging at the fares Virgin Atlantic are charging.
#952342 by VS075
24 Sep 2019, 09:50
CCFD1013 wrote:It really annoys me how Thomas Cook passengers have turned on Virgin Atlantic. Agree with AJC on Facebook you see people whinging at the fares Virgin Atlantic are charging.


Thomas Cook's rivals in the short-haul market have also been accused of profiting by putting up prices, even though these systems are programmed to fluctuate prices based on demand. The worst ones for price surging are holidays within the next few weeks.

I suppose if anyone is thinking of booking a trip next year somewhere that Thomas Cook served they may be better off waiting a few weeks for things to calm down. The hotel rooms will still be there and I'm sure flight capacity will be made up one way or another, particularly to key markets. I appreciate it's not good for anybody thinking of a last minute trip somewhere within the next few weeks who are now experiencing pricing blowing their budgets out the water.
#952387 by RLF
25 Sep 2019, 17:37
VS running 2 more rescue flight to MCO and BGI today, and with the new Tel Aviv service, the fleet are being kept utilised even with 2 x 350's on the JFK run.
#952634 by VS075
09 Oct 2019, 12:49
Some good news for the staff who worked in their shops. Hays Travel have acquired all of the Thomas Cook branches and can reopen them "immediately"...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49985369

The article also reports they have them for 6 months. Time will tell how many are kept on, particularly those that are near to existing Hays Travel stores. Either way, it's a great opportunity for the staff who are yet to find new jobs and should hopefully make their Christmases a bit easier given that's on the horizon.
#952642 by FLYERZ
09 Oct 2019, 20:28
I'm a bit surprised these physical-store travel agents still exist other than at the luxury/premium end. People these days can so easily get the same trip booked on the phone or online and especially for a cheap and cheerful week in Tenerife I think its not a stretch to think people could also DIY it via airline websites offering flight+hotel . In my mind I would only go to a physical store for a massive group trip with a complexed itinerary and even then I'd probably call.

Long story short, I think its good news for those that would have lost their jobs but I fear that what has happened to Thomas Cook points to changing behaviours which may mean that Hays too may struggle with a big physical presence.
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