#792141 by northernhenry
24 Sep 2011, 08:04
slinky09 wrote:
Sealink wrote:BA have acquired 6 daily slot pairs from BD at LHR.

Suggests another route facing the axe?

Article


Now that is what VS needs to do, quickly, or buy part of the damn thing.


Just thinking the very same y)
But given they still can't even decide what they are doing in terms of alliance or not, the chances of them organising the finance to grab any of the BMI stuff in a realistic timescale is looking very slim.. However no doubt some vague media announcements will occur....ending up with VS gaining none of the BMI stuff, and BA strolling in and grabbing slots left-right-centre
#792381 by Concorde RIP
27 Sep 2011, 10:51
Yawn!!! -- Not at the contributors on this forum, I'm as interested as you guys, but at VS dithering, posturing, non-action and boat missing.....

Harsh? Maybe, but you can only go so long with consultants (Deutsche Bank), to alliance or not etc, before the ground you started examining has shifted so much, that you need to start again.

I fear VS has no strong leadership and is floundering around.....meanwhile, BA go on the attack...
#792386 by tontybear
27 Sep 2011, 12:54
northernhenry wrote: and BA strolling in and grabbing slots left-right-centre


As I said before I reeally can't see the competition authorities allowing BA to have any more slots at LHR due to their pre-existing dominance at LHR.

The notion behind forcing BAA to sell LGW and STN was to promote 'competition' between airports. The next step is to improve competition between airlines.
#792392 by slinky09
27 Sep 2011, 13:30
tontybear wrote:
northernhenry wrote: and BA strolling in and grabbing slots left-right-centre


As I said before I really can't see the competition authorities allowing BA to have any more slots at LHR due to their pre-existing dominance at LHR.

The notion behind forcing BAA to sell LGW and STN was to promote 'competition' between airports. The next step is to improve competition between airlines.


I don't think this holds true at all, BA only has to point at CDG and FRA where the dominant airlines hold 50+ and 60+ per cent of slots compared to BA's 42% at LHR. So the precedence is there in the EU (which is superior to our competition authorities and they know it). Secondly, the competition commission has not even passed a memo about BA acquiring slots from anyone, which it does on a very regular basis, nor did it act when BA bought GB Airways for example. Nor did it act, unlike the FAA, when BA / AA ATI was granted.

There is plenty of competition in our airline industry really, just because BA has a leading position at LHR ignores the fact that FR probably flies more Brits short haul, and on a good proportion if not a majority one, most BA routes have some competition.

Comparing BAA to BA is also pointless in this context - the investigation into airport competition has nothing to do with airlines themselves.

So I don't see any action unless BA gets to at least 50% of the slots at LHR, even then, and there again, BA does not have the facilities to operate that many flights from LHR.
#794909 by slinky09
04 Nov 2011, 08:46
All over the news now, BMI bought by IAG, e.g. here. Wonder if VS will get thrown any dregs.
#794912 by nibbs
04 Nov 2011, 09:00
Just been announced http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/.

Good news for my BMI miles I hope, but a missed opportunity for VS perhaps? Depends on the price I guess.

nibbs
Last edited by Neil on 04 Nov 2011, 09:13, edited 1 time in total. Reason: Thread merged to keep all BMI takeover discussions in one thread.
#794925 by clarkeysntfc
04 Nov 2011, 12:16
Several interesting points arising from this announcement this morning.

The winners:
- seems likely that the BMI staff will keep their jobs.
- the regulatory review may force some slots to be released for competition reasons.

The losers:
- the consumer is the big loser here. Routes such as Moscow and Cairo will lose competition (and prices surely rise), and BA will now have no competition on UK domestic flying out of LHR.

Heathrow - it will be interesting to see how BA integrate BMI given that T5 is already overflowing into T3. Will BA return to T1?

Fleets - I expect BA will simply return the A330's to their lessors, and swallow up the BMI A320's.

Lastly, Virgin Atlantic. Their whinging about competition is utterly predictable, and really doesn't carry any weight when they were clearly unable to put any kind of realistic proposition together to take on BMI. I guess the only realistic option now is for VS to hope for a few more slots to be released by the regulators, but even if they do, do they have enough aircraft to utilise them? I think the bottom line is that VS is going to find itself squeezed harder and harder, and with no realistic alliance partner in sight I hope they have a strategy to make sure they survive.
#794931 by slinky09
04 Nov 2011, 14:19
Clarkey I agree with you, mostly. I do hope the regulators will give something to VS, maybe even BA / LH have done a side deal to sell some slots to VS to ward that off? I don't expect VS to make their customer David and Goliath sobs until this shakes out ...

So, we're nearing the end of the year in which we were promised a new fleet of A330s, an alliance, new UCS, and all - and all that's happened is a portion and a promise and with BMI gone, there also goes VS's chance. I'm wondering if anything is going to change, whether the rumours of an EH tie-up, or a global Virgin airline will ever happen too?

Will the cabin investment keep VS fresh long enough to be different and desirable ... the lack of route options / alliance does strain things when, if you're like me, you have to be a lot of places.
#794937 by clarkeysntfc
04 Nov 2011, 15:40
Thanks for the response Slinky, it does seem like VS is lacking a bit in the strategy department.

Although I'm a mere 1/2 times a year leisure traveller I do make sure we go out of our way to use VS e.g. spending a night in LAX due to G rewards rather than a direct BA flight to Seattle.

The clincher for me at the moment is the AMEX PE voucher, and I believe that VS has the best PE product around save perhaps for Air NZ
#794957 by slinky09
04 Nov 2011, 22:29
If VS has submitted a bid why is LH saying they're in exclusive talks with IAG?

Showmanship, idiocy, or something real? I think one of the former two when it comes to VS and its ability to do anything major, sadly.
#794960 by Bill S
04 Nov 2011, 22:51
The issue for VS is the cost of regional connections.
BA(LHR) has competition with AMS but VS is relying upon only London, limited MAN and very limited GLA.
VS needs to have a mechanism to make regional connections easier and more economic.
#794978 by slinky09
05 Nov 2011, 09:58
Bill S wrote:The issue for VS is the cost of regional connections.
BA(LHR) has competition with AMS but VS is relying upon only London, limited MAN and very limited GLA.
VS needs to have a mechanism to make regional connections easier and more economic.


If EK can fly from Newcastle, Manchester, Birmingham, London (x2) and Glasgow, perhaps VS could too!
#794980 by Virginlondon
05 Nov 2011, 10:21
There is a comment on airliners.net saying the reason EK/EY and some US carriers are so successful flying from regional airports is that they are feeding a hub. I flew to Sydney earlier this year with Etihad. The majority were transferring to and from European flights. This probably hasn't helped BMI over the years as there is less of a need to fly via Heathrow if based outside London.

I am sure Virgin will get something out of this process. They know it and BA know - hence why they are making such as fuss to ensure it is maximised.

Not sure its been mentioned on here, but Gatwick are spending alot of money updating the airport and its looking better. The CEO is desperate for a NY route - with the 330 and 787 I wonder whether Virgin will look at Gatwick again for some business flights and team up with easyjet for some connections from Europe.
#794985 by JCBR
05 Nov 2011, 12:43
One thing for certain if IAG get hold of BMI is that the BMI/VS partnership will end swiftly although as the TP were only on B\J tickets that will not make much difference to most.
#795309 by Concorde RIP
09 Nov 2011, 15:17
Looks like BA (erhem, IAG) are moving in for the kill:
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl ... mi-364307/
#795614 by Sealink
15 Nov 2011, 17:33
Just got an email from BD saying that LHR-TXL is reverting to LH but will be operated by BD aircraft... surely that's a sign that the deal is done? I can't see LH giving BA three prime spots a day to their home market!
#795621 by saverton
15 Nov 2011, 19:06
Sorry if I missed this but BMI are members of *A so if VA do buy them will they get the *A membership slot? If they do it may be just in time to stop me changing carriers (sorry VA the shine has worn off Gold for me so I want a flyer who will recognise me for the sheer number of miles I do and reward my loyalty with more than a clubhouse pass).
Virgin Atlantic

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