Redeeming miles seats

So… booked two tix using miles upgrade from Y (had to call VS as could not book that class online). Was able to secure one seat in UC both ways but not the other (left at PE).

Noted availability UC return leg today but was told that was reserved for UK-USA return so could not access. Advice? Ring back whenever we check in and see availability. But how will we know what is accessible? Must call and check.

So.. am "spending my miles" by first purchasing a very costly upgradeable fare. Am spending virtually same @ fee/surcharge for "using" miles, along with upgradeable fare.

Now--am told need to check in (every day?) when UC seat is released but may not actually be released as pre-determined rules over rule (making one think UK vs rest of world given priority for released seats?) . Typical @ time on phone checking? 10 minutes. Reality? Could be 10 minutes @ 0-100 days?

Challenge: actually do not have time to check in re release UC seats on anything more than casual basis. Think whole operation totally lame.

Reality: Tough. Surely reward miles should be website friendly?

V-Flyer thoughts?

[Neil]

Unfortunately if you want a miles seat that on a date that currently isn't available then you have to check daily or accept that you run the risk of missing one that could become available.

It takes max 5 mins to do a dummy miles booking on the VS website which will show if their is availability so can't see if it that time consuming.

Ultimately, only you can decide how important the upgrade is for you and how much time and effort you are prepared to put in to get it.

Neil

So my chief complaint is not that it takes a dummy booking every day (and that in itself IS annoying even if it is only 5 mins) it is that there ARE reward seats available on the dates I am looking for but they are being held for UK originating pax. There doesn't seem to be anyway to distinguish that status (and why there IS such a status is another question) without phoning Flying Club so that they can check. If the website reflected that information (as in --sorry these seats are not available to non-UK originating bookings) AND could allow booking it online (if available) that would be extremely helpful. In this day and age when upgrades are certainly not "free" and miles ease-of-use are critical to loyalty programs, this is, to me, getting very, very old. I haven't had any recent experiences with being offered the sometimes-ability to upgrade right on my booking--does that still happen?

[Neil]

I have never heard or experienced reward flights being reserved or held for certain pax. Obviously each flight has it's own reward seats but if there are seats available on the exact flight you want then I would give the UC line another call and speak to a supervisor if necessary. I thinking the agent just plain got it wrong or there was some misunderstanding somewhere as this just doesn't seem correct.

Out of interest, which flight, date are you wanting your UC reward flight on?

I can sympathise roadrunner and I have a feeling that your suspicions may very well be correct, although only someone in their revenue management department will know for certain and the agent you spoke to was likely guessing.

I have no real evidence for my viewpoint, only conjecture based upon the fact I have come across a difference on individual fare bucket prices dependent on whether the ticket was issued from the UK or the US. It really annoyed me at first, until I figured that all in all, it will probably work itself out when calculating the return price and various currency charges. Playing the system this way will only be of benefit if you are nesting fares over multiple bookings ... Be warned though, VS may cry foul if you start having multiple tickets issued in different currencies.

From this, the point is demonstrated that a single fare bucket can have two values at any single point in time dependent on market origin.... the reward fare buckets could be treated in a similar manner, so again I would not be surprised if the agent was in fact correct in their guess.

Hope you find the reward seats you are looking for 8D

[Neil]

Joey - what you are talking about is very different to the OP really. Yes, a fare will have a different cost depending on where the ticket is originating, this is common airline practice and totally normal.

What the OP is saying, is that there is a reward seat showing on the exact flight/date they want, but VS are saying they won't sell it to him - this is not right and not something VS should be doing or there is any reports of them doing such a thing in the past.

So if you log into FC through a different country webpage, does it show you different reward availability but only available to purchase for flight originating from that country

No--it shows as a reward seat on US, Canada site but will not allow a dummy booking--so on calling to check with FC told it is not available to non-originating UK flight.

[Neil]

What is the date / flight please?

23 March LHR-BOS (return leg)
Just spoke with FC where the agent saw the seat and was ready to book it but was locked out and queried supervisor re forcing it up. Was confirmed that although G seat is available it is not bookable on a return flight non Uk originating. When I queried the equity of availability to all FC members wishing to use miles, was told it is policy and that it should not be showing up on US/Canadian FC site. So this has me wondering how often I have been chasing the same seat that is closed to me (US/Canada) but open to my FC UK brethren!
I believe the booking challenge has to do with the fees and surcharges being different amounts (should they be?) and possibly currency difference but ultimately for me it means that although there is a UC G seat available -- it is not bookable. If anyone sees anything explaining this more logically in the FC terms would very much appreciate a reference.

Oh--and this leaves me to wondering how any of this is going to work once Delta (a US-based company) is added into the FC mix...

Joey - what you are talking about is very different to the OP really. Yes, a fare will have a different cost depending on where the ticket is originating, this is common airline practice and totally normal.

I don't think you have quite understood what I am saying Neil, I was using my experience to emphasise that differing market origins generate different price and availability, which is exactly what the OP is bumping up against - granted it is reward inventory but the principals are theoretically going to be the same... the G fares are simply another fare bucket with a different value (being available or not) depending on origin. Where is someone from revenue management to ask when you need them

For VS to be showing the reward as available but not bookable is just poor IT configuration, I think we all know that this is not a VS strength by now.

If anyone sees anything explaining this more logically in the FC terms would very much appreciate a reference.

Oh--and this leaves me to wondering how any of this is going to work once Delta (a US-based company) is added into the FC mix...

Have not seen anything in the FC terms and conditions about port of origin having a bearing on reward availability before roadrunner, doesn't mean there is not something buried in there though.... ii)

Ahh DL FFs spending on VS metal Theoretically, this kind of policy will separate availability between the UK and US markets to make it a bit more equitable. This will allow FFs from UK and US markets to have an equal chance on reward availability... my guess is that at a predetermined amount of time before a flight the reward seats available will allocate to a central pool to allow last minute upgrades on a first come first served basis. I can understand and actually support this kind of thinking - if, indeed, this is actually happening and we are not dealing with a colossal IT screw up :w

Just seen you have posted UC in your itinerary. This mean you have managed to get the return reward seat too?

Different pricing depending on point of sale is common in the industry. I get a cheaper seat booking my flights from DAR to DXB in DAR than I do in DXB - for the same flights....

In the old days, we used to talk about SITI and SOTO, and some airlines still stress over this... I gave up stressing about that sort of malarkey years ago, and started working for airlines that recognised it for the sort of cr*p it is. But the point of ticketing still makes a difference sometimes, and I've never known one give you a heads-up about it in the T&Cs...

Hi Joey

Thanks --I had been able to book one UC through seat but was flummoxed in adding another so that is the the PE upgrade both ways I have been seeking with the one looking enticingly available return but yet not.

I'm sure I am far less conversant with the balances of award seats as others re availability but personally I feel strongly that they should be available to all FC members at the same time if in fact we all have to adhere to the same rule to acquire them, the same rather onerous fees to use them and the same criteria in qualifying upgrade fares. I could understand if seats were awarded to Gold members before Red but UK before others? I have been a VS FC member for many years and have always thought that it has been a level playing field for snagging upgrade or award seats. Now that the attending fees are serious change that has become a less lively sport. Adding in a national differential seems just one more nail in the coffin re loyalty--so not okay. My thoughts only but there they are!

Different pricing depending on point of sale is common in the industry. I get a cheaper seat booking my flights from DAR to DXB in DAR than I do in DXB - for the same flights....

In the old days, we used to talk about SITI and SOTO, and some airlines still stress over this... I gave up stressing about that sort of malarkey years ago, and started working for airlines that recognised it for the sort of cr*p it is. But the point of ticketing still makes a difference sometimes, and I've never known one give you a heads-up about it in the T&Cs...

I remember handwriting tickets with SITI and getting a buzz when I had to write a SOTO one. It was just letters really.

SO - Sold outside country of origin
SI - Sold inside ticket of origin

T - Ticketed

The real killers were SITO and SOTI!

THEN watch the fares rocket!

So… still whistling in the wind for using miles to upgrade from PE to UC despite the site showing seats wide open for the return flight and having shown the outbound date as available on several occasions. Click in, got to book--and get "sorry seats unavailable please call" so call and get same.

I don't mind waiting to see if seats are released--it's that they clearly are open, appear on the website but are un-bookable. Any other US pax having challenges with using miles?
Happy Christmas to all (even tho feeling VS FC are a bit Grinch-like right now!)

Ah....thanks Father Christmas (FC!). So on 26 December, miles seats finally opened for non-UK originating flights BOS-LHR March. Still don't quite see logic to it as the last seats to be released were weekend flights but was tipped by a FC agent that seats might be available soon--and they were. Snapped up the one that meant we weren't drawing straws about who had to sit down back and handed over the miles and the hundreds of dollars needed to claim 'free' tix.

Very pleased with the result, very annoyed at the process (I mean really? Miles seats for some of us but not all of us--shut down at the booking phase and now I suppose will have to do the same thing for seat choice. I was allowed to choose a seat when I booked the first seat originally and told it was within the window before seat choice as well became a commodity, but that has disappeared.Had I booked using Skymiles with Delta, I would have been able to choose my seat online. The same seats with Sky cost $304 taxes/fees and 100,000 miles which makes for some serious thinking about which program is most viable given the new regime. Am feeling that recent fall to Red (first time in over 15 years) may be a longer drop than expected!


Merry Christmas!