A330 NEO order Farnborough Airshow ?

There's a bit more detail in VS's own press release here

There's a table showing A/C fleet today vs. expected fleet in Q1 2028

Overall net increase of just 1 A/C.

Still going to be a Russian roulette lottery game between 787, Neo and A350…. Unless as they are rendering some leases for 787 that they refit them

To my knowledge, there are zero A330-300’s configured with a “leisure” type configuration in upper, there are the “wonderful” A350’s that have a smaller upper cabin. I wonder if any A330-900’s will be configured with a leisure configuration or will the leisure routes be stuck with the A350’s ?

I know most of the A330-300 flights I’ve been on in upper have been full or nearly full even on the leisure routes. Interesting times ahead.

David

I don’t think we will see a Leisure 339 config. The demand at the moment is ‘Premium Leisure’ - Of course this could change - As such the J/W cabins are lucrative.

I would actually go as far as to say I think VS may regret even having the 350 leisure config - granted at the time they never knew how the market would change.

When you think of it, the leisure config was designed for the 747 routes however with the exception of LAS/BGI/MCO (that I can think of) the other airports MBJ/ANU etc can’t actually accommodate A350’s at all.

I think 350 refits to mainline should be put on the cards.

I am more interested to see what they settle on sending us at Manchester. The A350 leisure seems to be where they’re heading but it’s way too big for most of the routes from MAN other than school holidays. I’ve been on it many times where Upper and premium are full and economy is virtually empty.
I doubt we’ll get the A330neo as the flagship (and nicest) so that leaves the remaining 787’s. Not being refurbished so old Upper cabin, that would be my bet. However that would mean getting flight deck to move to Manchester, would there be any takers for that. Interesting times ahead indeed.

One thing to consider is should you be dependent on just a single supplier, or is it better to have some competition for your business...?

I think this is very positive news for VS considering it’s financial situation over the past few years. I think the NEO is the right size for the airlines on most routes that’s why we are seeing more orders. In the CH aviation article it says VS have options of another 9 A330 NEO’s so that something to keep an eye on. I think you will see this plane at MAN eventually as it’s a like for like swop plus I think it would be idea for the MAN to LAX route that was stopped during Covid.

As for the 787 it the short term I think it sticks around post 2030 I’m not so sure. Plus I think they would need to notify pilots and the union if they were getting rid of them. But I’m sure DL leadership have influence this Airbus order.

[mitchja]

Regarding VS at MAN, the MAN>JFK flight seems to be switching to an leisure A350 next year for the summer season.

Everything else for 2025 so far looks to be the same as it is now with ATL still using an A333 and MCO using 1 x A333 + 1 x A350 as well as the winter season only BGI flights also using an A333.

VS did briefly op B789's at MAN towards the end of the travel lockdown as I flew to BGI from MAN and back on a B789 in September 2021 which was the only VS flight operating at the time from MAN.

One thing to consider is should you be dependent on just a single supplier, or is it better to have some competition for your business...?

That doesn’t seem to harm the LCCs such as easyJet and Ryanair who have all-Airbus and all-Boeing fleets.

It’s fair to say Boeing and the 787s have caused VS more grief in the last 15 years than the three Airbus types introduced in that time. They were three years late and then subject to the engine issues affecting all RR-powered 787s.

In the case of VS, it’s a legitimate question as to whether their fleet size stacks up to be economically viable to operate planes with similar capabilities from two different manufacturers. As far as I’m aware, the 787s and A330/A350s have their own pilot pools and it takes some time to convert from one to the other. Less so for A330 to A350 and I think they may already be type rated on each other, though could be wrong.

A330 and A350 have a common type rating

Most interesting in this article is 3 787s will leave the fleet.

I do wonder if this is VS selling their owned 789s to try and pay down some debt moving to an all leased fleet... Either that or they're getting a better deal on 339s and just choosing to release some 789s in the process.

Most interesting in this article is 3 787s will leave the fleet.

I do wonder if this is VS selling their owned 789s to try and pay down some debt moving to an all leased fleet... Either that or they're getting a better deal on 339s and just choosing to release some 789s in the process.

VS only own G-VOWS and G-VMAP. They have been unpredictable about which aircraft they choose to retire as proven with G-VGBR and G-VNYC being the first A333s to leave the fleet in September, when they are younger than most of the others. With the 789s VS will probably be considering which ones are giving them more issues, like G-VFAN which had recently been out of service for months.

It said in the press release that 7 leases with AerCap for the 787 have been extend so I’m guessing it’s the ones that are with Avolon and Griffin leasing companies. I read in VS most recent annual report that they want to own 50% of aircraft going forward.

It said in the press release that 7 leases with AerCap for the 787 have been extend so I’m guessing it’s the ones that are with Avolon and Griffin leasing companies. I read in VS most recent annual report that they want to own 50% of aircraft going forward.

Who are G-VDIA and G-VNYL with? Those are the 2 that they sold off during Covid.

Interesting that there are 9 A339 options. Not enough to cover a B789 replacement on a 1:1 basis (the shortfall would be 5 - around the same as they have based at MAN - yes I am cynical) but perhaps enough for “expansion” as opposed to “transformation”. Also helpful for DL to have in group options.

The fleet plan for 2028 is as follows as per the Airbus VS press conference.
12 A350-1000s
19 A330neos
14 B787-9s

So we have lost 2 A350’s orders which I think VS have quietly converted to the NEO and 3 B787’s most likely due to the fact that most 787’s are leased.

This article confirms that indeed they have dropped 2 A350-10 orders from the lessor.
https://www.flightglobal.com/air-transp ... 73.article

So I had a look and the 2 787’s G-VDIA and G-VNYL and they are owned by Griffin asset management so we might see them leave when there leases are up. Going back to the A350 and the NEO swop I could not see where VS were getting the funds from thats why I came to that conclusion. The NEO is ideal for the east cost routes to the US. I think someone mentioned we might get them in MAN by the end of the year so my upgrade voucher will come in handy.

So I had a look and the 2 787’s G-VDIA and G-VNYL and they are owned by Griffin asset management so we might see them leave when there leases are up. Going back to the A350 and the NEO swop I could not see where VS were getting the funds from thats why I came to that conclusion. The NEO is ideal for the east cost routes to the US. I think someone mentioned we might get them in MAN by the end of the year so my upgrade voucher will come in handy.

G-VNYL is only 6 years old at the moment, so I’d say that is very unlikely. G-VNEW is coming up 10 years old and by 2028 will be 14. It will probably be 3 of the older ones (delivered in 2014 & 2015) that they opt to get rid of.

So I had a look and the 2 787’s G-VDIA and G-VNYL and they are owned by Griffin asset management so we might see them leave when there leases are up. Going back to the A350 and the NEO swop I could not see where VS were getting the funds from thats why I came to that conclusion. The NEO is ideal for the east cost routes to the US. I think someone mentioned we might get them in MAN by the end of the year so my upgrade voucher will come in handy.

G-VNYL is only 6 years old at the moment, so I’d say that is very unlikely. G-VNEW is coming up 10 years old and by 2028 will be 14. It will probably be 3 of the older ones (delivered in 2014 & 2015) that they opt to get rid of.

I wonder if time left towards a heavy check will play a factor?