GOING ON HOLIDAY IN SCHOOL TERM TIME

Has anyone else had the hassles like I've had from our local school.

My husband has a fixed period when he can take his holidays and for me, as a childminder, the bulk of my earning potential is during school holidays when the schools are shut and the children have to come to me.

I have asked the school for just five days out and not during exam time and the Headmaster is just not listening. To take the same holiday entirely during school holidays will cost another £1800 on top of the £2500 that I have already paid

My daughter is in the lower end of school and is top of the top set for all her subjects so is not a failing pupil. We only ever get two weeks holiday a year as it is, which believe me we really need!!

Before some of you knock me down and tell me I'm affecting my daughters education etc etc. Yes I know all about that but I just don't agree, not for the sake of five days.

Perplexed and feeling not in control of my own life[:(!]

Rant over, thanks for listening

thelaceys

So it would be £800 cheaper to go anyway and risk the £1000 max fine.

Originally posted by easygoingeezer
So it would be £800 cheaper to go anyway and risk the £1000 max fine.

Well actually no, this is the silly thing about it.

Our local education authority says that if you take more than 5 days unapproved time during any one term then they will issue a fixed penalty notice, which I believe is £100 for each parent.

I only want 5 days, so I can take this without permission with no fine and my daughter will go down as an unauthorised absentee and this will show on the school's record when the Ofsted people come to inspect them and that doesn't look good for the school.

So what's the point of saying no when they know that I will probably take it anyway and they will lose out[:?]

thelaceys (still meditating)

Don't get me started - oh alright then.

My daughter has only just started school and next Christmas will be the first time we have had to deal with this. I think it is absolute hokum of the highest order.

Our daughters school policy states..
"government guidelines states that parents are responsible in LAW for ensuring their children attend school every day during term time unless there is a good reason, such as illness. Parents do NOT have a right to take children on holiday during term time, but if there are extenuating circumstances you can complete a request form for a ÔLeave of AbsenceÕ, which will be considered by myself, and depending on the reason for absence I may or may not grant permission. In law I may consider a request for up to 10 days in any one year, however there is no automatic right for this to be granted"

Now I'm sorry but removing a 5 year old from school a week early for Christmas is not effecting her education and I'm not happy that you have to virtually beg the school to let them go. Most holidays if handled right by both schools and parents can become educational in their own rights. As it is getting a flight at even a half decent price - let alone using miles - is proving virtually impossible.

The basic problem is the ofsted figures that put far too much emphasis on attendance - especially the authorised absence figures. Whilst I agree that at certain times it is vital to attend school I also feel that with the exception of certain blackout periods children should have the right to 10 days authorised absence per year providing they are not failing and that there is an agreement to include an educational element to the trip. Whilst this may be unrealistic the ideal would be to have a slightly extended school year and allow pupils and teachers to take time off during the term.

Unfortunatly I cannot see the situation improving anytime soon and therefore I can only look forward to being at the sharp end of supply and demand for the next 12 years.

My sypathies to you thelaceys and I hope common sense prevails.

Phil FM

P.S.

Interestingly just found this reference here.

Family holidays

Under education law parents may request absence for pupils from school due to a family holiday. It is for schools to determine whether or not they agree to a family holiday during term time. Schools may authorise absence for this purpose for up to 10 school days in any school year. In exceptional cases schools may agree to a lengthier period.

In considering any request for holiday absence, schools should look at individual circumstances and take account of:

the stage of education and progress.
the time of year proposed for the trip
its nature and parents' wishes
the overall attendance pattern of the pupil
the pupil's stage of education and progress.

Great!I am really looking forward to this hocum pocum when my eldest starts primary school in August.

Why cant they take homework with them on holiday?

I really wish you all the luck and hope you get something sorted.

Thanks for the comments Phil, sort of glad you feel the same way, I was beginning to think maybe it was me losing the plot.

Looks like common sense is not going to prevail. Got a letter from school this morning which basically says if I can't afford the extra cost of a holiday in school holidays then I should change my holiday to something that I can afford.

I was seething, I don't think it is for the Headmaster of a school to dictate where I should go!

I really need to lie down in a darkened room, I'm letting this get to me way too much. Deep Breathing exercises now commencing

thelaceys

[Scrooge]

I feel sorry for all parents, back in the day parents were allowed to be parents.

I can understand not pulling a 15 year old out of school during exam week, but a 5 year old..what are they going to miss, colouring 101.

It's probably too late now but I remember reading something saying that cost alone would not be considered a reason for approval of absence.

Based on this I decided that when asking for permission I would use any other argument I could think of - e.g. Marriage of a relative, Some date that needed to be targeted etc.

Phil

[honey lamb]

Before school terms were published in advance I wrongly calculated the end of Aer John's summer term. The response of the school principal was that travel was equally as educational and there was no problem.

Similarly when he was in secondary school and needed a couple of days off to play in the Virgin Atlantic Swingers golf final in the UK, the principal took the view that the experience was something that could not be taught in school and should be grasped.

For the last seven years we send in the standard letter requesting the holiday, we always get the bog standard letter back. Don't worry about it. I teach in school!!! If they want to pay me all the overtime etc I am owed, then maybe I could afford to take all five of us in the school holidays.

Kaz

Maybe you can speak to her teachers and ask them for some work and then go to the head and show him that she isn't going to be missing out on too much and will catch up[:?]

VS.

I really do think that some schools (and their head teachers) adopt a holier than thou attitude when it comes to absences for holidays. Perhaps they have share in travel companies or hotel chains So what would happen if your child became ill over the dates you were proposing for a holiday, would the school attempt to dictate her attendance.

Anyway, what about the times schools close for 'teacher training' (always done during school holidays in my time), or close because we have a couple of centimetres of snow [V]

Best of luck laceys - go for it!

Yeah, I'm sure it wouldn't be the end of the world if lacey jr. just happened to come down with flu on the dates of your holiday[}:)]

VS.

Have you talked to the teacher(s) affected? Perhaps they might help you present your case if you ask them. You could mention where you're going (if you have firm plans) and ask if an independent study report would be acceptable on top of required homework. No headmaster could argue a parent was depriving a young student of knowledge if the student could return with proof of something learnt - and share it!

A camera, a sound recording device (tape, digital, DVD, or other sound playback, your choice), even paint or crayon or pencil, all would serve as artistic and fun - for your family and the schoolmates. If you're artistic also, a scrapbook would make a book for all to share in. Years from now, I'm sure it would be a fond way to revisit the Great Adventure.

Museums, nature studies, even a language study could all serve, and think of what the other children could learn from your own Lacey Jr. Perhaps you'd be raising up a young teacher. I dare any Headmaster or US Principal to fuss about that!

Thanks everyone for all your replies, I didn't realise I would get such a response.

The letter from the headteacher stated it would be detrimental to the smooth running of the school for my daughter to be absent (she must be incredibly important).

I did try to make an appointment to go and speak to the headteacher and all I got was delay tactics and telephone calls via the headteachers private secretary who actually admitted that she was not really familiar with how the school runs and was just his secretary!!!

The Head doesn't want a face to face meeting and refuses to back down, even though at our first visit to the school he stood up in front of all the new parents and said if there are any problems at all, my door is always open, come and talk to me!!!

I must say I had a look at the link on FM's reply and that frightened me to death. £2500 fine and 3 months in prison!!!!!!

My daughter is 12 and wants to be a Marine Biologist, she has done for a long long time and when we go off to Orlando we spend the majority of that time seeking out wildlife, talking with locals and taking photographs. We don't spend our time sunbathing and visiting theme parks so I think that's educational enough, but still not enough for the school it seems.

thelaceys

i know this may sound daft but is it worth approaching your local education authority for advice?

I think telling him where to go would be detrimental to your cause, but that's what I'd be doing now[:w]

VS.

Originally posted by motherger
i know this may sound daft but is it worth approaching your local education authority for advice?

Yep I did think of that and have e-mailed them but no answer as yet

thelaceys

[HighFlyer]

Admittedly, i dont have children, and have no plans to have any, but i honestly believe that a holiday in a foreign country, partaking in new persuits, experiencing new cultures, languages, foods and all the other wonderful experiences of travelling offer a child far more in education than a week of the national curriculum. I dont say that as a excuse to take children out of school, but provided that the child is ahead in their schoolwork, and they are not missing out on anything important (field trips, mock exams, etc) and time is taken on vacation to read and keep up with the class schedule, then i really do not see the issue.

Thanks,
Sarah

I don't know if the same Mastercard Ad is running in the UK, but the gist of it is a family trip to Egypt x Egyptian pounds, blah, blah... and it ends with "Lessons learnt out of School - Priceless".

How true!
My Holidays and schedules a pretty much fixed by project constraints, and since I work away from home a lot of the time the quality time had the kids is far more important. Their old head teacher used to pretty much quote the mastercard advert!
Though their mother is a little more difficuly to convince these days.[:(]

Junior JP was always coming down with the sniffles in term time[}:)]

Originally posted by jaguarpig
Junior JP was always coming down with the sniffles in term time[}:)]

Unfortunately the stoopid policy being adopted just forces you to tell lies!!

Send in a sick note and then just call the school a couple of times when you are away!! Totally agree with Sarah - how are children supposed to get a rounded education and understand the world better if they never go anywhere - and never going anywhere is going to happen if parents are forced to only take holidays during shchool holiday times when they perhaps cannot afford them!!

Based on the current news story about the UK coming bottom (interestingly just behind the US) of a Unicef league table for child well being it is quite obvious that we in the UK are failing our children big time.

Out of 21 wealthy industrialised countries the UK came 17th in Educational Well being and 21st in Family and Peer relationships so it's quite obvious that the educational system is failing anyway. These draconian attitudes to family holidays are simply affecting the ability of parents to spend quality time with their offspring during the formulative years. Faced with the choice of paying double during school holidays parents are choosing shorter holidays or no holidays at all and children lose out on important personal development. It's about time schools start asking the question what is best for the child rather than how to keep their own well oiled, but often fatally flawed, machine running.

Phil FM

I am taking my 8 year old nephew to Florida, 5 days out of school term, I told them he had an appointment to meet an astronaught and that this would be educational as he is top of his class in science studies. I produced a book for him to complete with questions and answer sections about, planning holidays, preparing for holidays, health and safety and how airports work and a daily diary of what he had done. He loved his holiday activity book and took it to school, the teacher thought it was brillient.

[fozzyo]

Originally posted by easygoingeezer
I am taking my 8 year old nephew to Florida, 5 days out of school term, I told them he had an appointment to meet an astronaught and that this would be educational as he is top of his class in science studies. I produced a book for him to complete with questions and answer sections about, planning holidays, preparing for holidays, health and safety and how airports work and a daily diary of what he had done. He loved his holiday activity book and took it to school, the teacher thought it was brillient.

What a fantastic idea! That really is brilliant, and goes to show how easily you can engage kids in education.

My Dad was a teacher, deputy head and now school inspector. No time off school for holidays for us. :o(

The whole thing is so rediculous of you ask me, 5days when they aren't in a critical year / time of year isn't going to harm their education. Its going to enhance it as it gives them so many opportunities to learn new stuff, and to share that with the other kids when they return.

Anyway, isn't it trialling home schooling for a week?