Problems For An UC Pax at LHR

Hello All,

Just been reading a thread on Trip Advisor Air Travel Forum about a pax who went to check in for an UC flight to JFK.
The story that is being told is that he was told the flight was overbooked and he would be downgraded.
He apparently re-booked with another airline.
I would be absolutely mortified if this happened to us!
Any thoughts from you experts please.

Thank You

[Neil]

All airlines overbook, it is common practice and happens on loads of flights every day. It is however rare for pax to be downgraded or offloaded because of it. Usually there are always other pax willing to take the offered compensation for another flight/class of travel.

And if they refused the downgrade on that flight there are other LHR-NYC flights they could be moved too AND they would be offered compensation / incentives.

However rebooking themselves onto another airline is in my mind silly as they would loose the £ they paid for their ticket on VS.

Did they give VS the opportunity to rebook them onto a later flight or with another operator?

Sounds a bit fishy (and admitedly I dont know all the details) to me

I have heard of this happening beofre on VS, only a few times and mostly from PE, I believe it is very rare though. As others have said there are better options they will offer before trying to downgrade you.

If you ever were downgraded, you can claim 75% of the fare back (not taxes, fees and surchages though)

I agree there are probebly more details or not the full facts told.
We all know the airlines overbook but usually there are enough voluntary downgrades or offloads to get enough seats. Even if not then members of FC would get priority, miles upgrades would probably be downgraded (I saw this happen on UA).

I do not think that you ever be sent away to make your own arrangements - with 5 flights to NY each day plus several codeshares with CO I find it hard to believe that an UC pax would not be accomodated .. unles they had a hissy fit at check-in and stormed off (seen that as well and no, it wasn;t me !)

http://www.tripadvisor.in/ShowTopic-g1- ... ravel.html

Thans for the link. What I notice is that the complainant says they 'booked an UC ticket' rather than 'bought'. Maybe I am being pedantic but it is possible they were on a miles upgrade and downgraded to the seat they paid for.

Thanks Penny

Still strange though as the pax said they took anoher flight on another carrier but not that they paid for that flight.

Also a stong implication that VS wern't offering the correct EU compensation.

it is possible they were on a miles upgrade and downgraded to the seat they paid for.

A miles upgraded fare is fully "paid for" , both in terms of miles used to purchase the upgraded G fare and in terms of extra fees.
I don't believe VS utilise the same policy as airlines like UA but ISTBC.
DL

This happened to my girlfriend and I when I took her to NYC in UC for a surprise birthday present. She got all giddy and tearful as we approached the UC desk and when they said the flight was full (very politely) the tears really did start.

We were offered 25k miles each and a guaranteed seat in PE, which we took, after all, better to be in NYC than Heathrow. We still got access to the clubhouse and just as we were about to leave to board, our names were called and we were told two seats had become available, albeit one upstairs and one in the nose, and we accepted them gladly (I hadn't been able to choose seats before hand so had no reason to moan). I spent the majority of the flight on the ottoman as this seemed like the most sociable way to enjoy the time together.

So it does happen, but it sounds like in this case the PAX was too impatient and got unlucky with the decisions they made.

This happened to my girlfriend and I when I took her to NYC in UC for a surprise birthday present. She got all giddy and tearful as we approached the UC desk and when they said the flight was full (very politely) the tears really did start.

We were offered 25k miles each and a guaranteed seat in PE, which we took, after all, better to be in NYC than Heathrow. We still got access to the clubhouse and just as we were about to leave to board, our names were called and we were told two seats had become available, albeit one upstairs and one in the nose, and we accepted them gladly (I hadn't been able to choose seats before hand so had no reason to moan). I spent the majority of the flight on the ottoman as this seemed like the most sociable way to enjoy the time together.

So it does happen, but it sounds like in this case the PAX was too impatient and got unlucky with the decisions they made.

I'm not surprised! That's awful, I really hate it when airlines and hotels for that matter overbook. I'm glad it got sort of sorted out for you.

We have travelled on the VS17 on several occasions in the past when it was flown with an A340-300. Each time we asked about bulk head seats, we were told that these were kept for UC downgrades. It was obvious on each flight that there was at least 1-2 passengers who had been downgraded. So my experience is that downgrading from UC to PE is quite common!

To concur with GingerFlyer's experience, I flew back from Newark on Friday night on VS2 and they were overbooked in Upper Class. I was in PE and was trying to get the elusive 28A or C PE exit row seats and was told in the clubhouse that they were held because VS was looking for UC downgrade customers.

Eventually two ladies appeared and took these seats. One was accepting of her situation and had taken the miles and vouchers, the other sitting right in front of me in 28C was not happy at all. I think she had been told one thing by someone and a confilcting story by another - both landside. (Sorry about the vagueness but the chap I was sitting next to would not shut up so it was difficult to earwig )

She was given vouchers and spent a lot of time talking to various crew members who were very patient and did a great job understanding and placating her. I think they may have been 3 seats overbooked in Upper as there was another chap hanging around the bar area while we were on the ground and I'm not sure if he ended up in PE or upper.

If someone is willing to pay full fare for a late booking, it is not surprising that airlines are willing to occasionally bump someone on a much lower fare.
I only wish they would allow you to register when booking for voluntary denied boarding (VDB) with re-booking on a +- 2 day basis.

Many of us hope for VDB opportunities and much better for an amicable settlement with considerable revenue gain to the airline (compare Z & J prices). That would be an occasion when a few phone calls could be well worth while.

We have travelled on the VS17 on several occasions in the past when it was flown with an A340-300. Each time we asked about bulk head seats, we were told that these were kept for UC downgrades. It was obvious on each flight that there was at least 1-2 passengers who had been downgraded. So my experience is that downgrading from UC to PE is quite common!

Yes when there aren't babies around the from PE seats seem to be the flex seats for cabin changes. I've asked before for these seats to be told they were held for Au PAX being upgraded from Y due to overbooking of Y.

This happened to my girlfriend and I when I took her to NYC in UC for a surprise birthday present. She got all giddy and tearful as we approached the UC desk and when they said the flight was full (very politely) the tears really did start.

I have a lot of sympathy for anyone in this situation but the EU compensation is quite generous for a downgrade. (Were you offered it?)

Does anyone know approximately how many seats Virgin overbook in each class per flight? Do they overbook less on the bucket and spade routes or a destination where there is only one flight a day?

Does anyone know approximately how many seats Virgin overbook in each class per flight? Do they overbook less on the bucket and spade routes or a destination where there is only one flight a day?

Less to none on leisure routes, more likely on high business routes like New York.

I have a lot of sympathy for anyone in this situation but the EU compensation is quite generous for a downgrade. (Were you offered it?)

From my reading there is actually no compensation for a downgrade other than a refund of part of the ticket costs.

This would apply to VS flights as they are external to the EU

(c) 75 % of the price of the ticket for all flights not falling
under (a) or (b), including flights between the European
territory of the Member States and the French overseas
departments.

See Article Ten

That is not to say that an airline won't offer compensation to a downgraded pax just that they are not required to under the regulations.

[Neil]

Does anyone know approximately how many seats Virgin overbook in each class per flight? Do they overbook less on the bucket and spade routes or a destination where there is only one flight a day?

Less to none on leisure routes, more likely on high business routes like New York.

They definitely do overbook on leisure routes. When we were checking in at MCO at Easter they had a big list of the overbookings that day and what to offer pax.

They definitely do overbook on leisure routes. When we were checking in at MCO at Easter they had a big list of the overbookings that day and what to offer pax.

and what were they offering?

[Neil]

They definitely do overbook on leisure routes. When we were checking in at MCO at Easter they had a big list of the overbookings that day and what to offer pax.

and what were they offering?

It varied as they were offering some pax alternative flights to MAN instead of LGW, with transfers back to LGW and some miles. Others were offered to fly the next day with free flight voucher. We saw 3 different sets of people take one or other of the offers.

I was at the boarding gate at LAS once when they asked over the tannoy if there were 3 passengers who were willing to fly the next day and spend the night in a strip hotel free of charge and accept some dollars (they didn't stipulate over the tannoy how much) - you should have seen the scrum of potential passengers prepared to be bumped off the flight! There were a couple of OAPs that would have given Usain Bolt a run for his money! ):

[Neil]

I was at the boarding gate at LAS once when they asked over the tannoy if there were 3 passengers who were willing to fly the next day and spend the night in a strip hotel free of charge and accept some dollars (they didn't stipulate over the tannoy how much) - you should have seen the scrum of potential passengers prepared to be bumped off the flight! There were a couple of OAPs that would have given Usain Bolt a run for his money! ):

That sums it up pretty well.

For every pax that *must* get home on the flight, there are usually plenty of pax who are more than willing to delay for a day or so, take the fairly generous compensation offered and fly another day/cabin.

That is why we don't hear many horror stories of pax who have had to be bumped off/down a cabin. Yes, overbooking happens all the time of every airline, but it usually works itself out in the end.

That is not to say that an airline won't offer compensation to a downgraded pax just that they are not required to under the regulations.

Hi tonty, I'm not sure I understand you? Article 10 stipulates that 75% of the ticket cost shall be reimbursed to the passenger on a flight >3,500 km. That's what I meant when I said I think the EU compensation is generous.