New LGW Config

Might now be a good time to remind people that on V-Flyer we play the ball NOT the player?... Just putting it out there...

Should I expect people to be playing with my balls ):

Might now be a good time to remind people that on V-Flyer we play the ball NOT the player?... Just putting it out there...

Should I expect people to be playing with my balls ):

Well thank goodness for a controversial and provocative post for once after all the bland nonsense that has gone before...

Out of curiosity, do you travel in Y, W or J?

I am getting a tad concerned about the tone of some of the comments on this thread which seem to be more about the people who fly in a particular cabin rather than the services provided in that cabin.

Lets face it there are lovely people who fly in UC/PE and Y and there are some horrible people who also travel in UC/PE and Y.

Absolutely spot on y)
Wow, just logged on. What has happened to this interesting discussion - agree with tontybear this is getting a bit out of hand v( v(

Might now be a good time to remind people that on V-Flyer we play the ball NOT the player?... Just putting it out there...

Should I expect people to be playing with my balls ):

Well thank goodness for a controversial and provocative post for once after all the bland nonsense that has gone before...

Out of curiosity, do you travel in Y, W or J?

Last few years in J but have done Y & W before, just to be more controvertial I am doing J in BA next trip as they were £800 cheaper!!

UC is just so over rated, I've decided to fly Y herein because apparently it's much more entertaining "down the back".

Back on topic, be interesting to see the opening comment confirmed, but I still view not putting in new UC to be a huge mistake, and a massive missed opportunity. But it also signals to me the utter balls ups that VS can make, and is a continuation of the whole A333 / UC saga balls-up in the first place. I mean really, VS has been planning new UC for years, could they really not line up a few ducks?

[honey lamb]

OK, so I've been slow to come to the table on this one but I have read the posts with interest and have just a few observations to make - and that's just what they are, observations

Just to set out my stall, the first time I travelled in the bubble of a 747 was in Economy on an SAA flight to JNB. I was surprised to find that they seated economy in the upper deck and as my previous experience on a 747 had been in BA ten years previously I wasn't in any position to compare. To my mind it was like any other flight on a small aircraft and nothing special except that we went upstairs. Since then I have flown in both UC and PE from LHR when the upper deck was a UC/PE split but I have never flown in an upper deck cabin which was solely UC or PE. I have also flown in PE in both of the 340 aircraft

For those of you who are concerned that PE passengers will be held back because of Y passengers in the cabin, the upper deck was allowed to disembark at the same time as the premium cabins downstairs and I haven't seen any trip reports of people who have flown on LHR flights in the bubble with the UC/Y split to say that they were held back.

There is an assumption that the arrangement with VH to have half the upstairs cabin will continue. mitchja has given the conditions under which VH passengers can access these seats but there is nothing to say that this will continue. Wait and see.

To whoever said that having stairs on a plane is no longer a novelty, sorry but I must disagree. OK, so I mostly fly in the front of the plane of a 747 but I still find myself gazing at the stairs. For people who do not fly on a 747 on a regular basis I can imagine the fascination. As regards to the A380, I flew on the upper deck of Singapore Airlines last November. We boarded from a jetway that was attached to the upper deck so from that perspective it was like boarding any other plane. There was a stairways leading down to the Suites area but it was cordoned off so no hope of going downstairs for a quick peek v(

Finally, I do not like being referred to as the "grey market". I am no different to any other person who is looking for the best fare for where I want to go but lean towards certain carriers because of my experience of them

I'm just happy to be getting my bum on a seat and going on holiday! Have to say I'm very surprised about how much snobbery is showing on here. And for the record my children don't run around and cause a problem.

which is all very fair groovychic but sadly some people are travelling on business and the excitement levels are tempered by the need for rest and quiet. no one is saying all kids or any particlar persons offspring are ill behaved but sadly it does happen. and more kids are flying EC....... apologies from a snob...now back to the caviar and champagne (sorry fizzy wine !!)

Just my 2 cents on the subject.

I really like flying PE in the bubble mainly because there is just so much more room than downstairs. So I'm dissapointed that the number of upstairs seats is going to half, assuming that the pitch remains the same...

In terms of Y passengers disembarking first, that already happens with the the small Y cabin downstairs, which under these proposals will be removed, so there's no change here, or if you are in PE downstairs a big improvement as they'll be first off.

[buns]

From the comments in this thread, it would seem that the perception of the majority is VS has overlooked the Unique Selling Point of the PE product on LGW/MAN routes, namely a roomy cabin the gives an air of exclusivity at a price folks are wiilling to pay.

Now if that is the perception, then VS have to make a real effort in convincing passengers that any change does not diminish the experience and not rely on their usual smoke and mirrors trick of hype that does not relate to the product experience.

I am sure their computer models have worked out the optimum numbers of PE seats that maximises revenue, but if the changes impact on the experience, then people will vote with thier wallets, even if it is to an inferior product.

buns

From the comments in this thread, it would seem that the perception of the majority is VS has overlooked the Unique Selling Point of the PE product on LGW/MAN routes, namely a roomy cabin the gives an air of exclusivity at a price folks are wiilling to pay.

Now if that is the perception, then VS have to make a real effort in convincing passengers that any change does not diminish the experience and not rely on their usual smoke and mirrors trick of hype that does not relate to the product experience.

I am sure their computer models have worked out the optimum numbers of PE seats that maximises revenue, but if the changes impact on the experience, then people will vote with thier wallets, even if it is to an inferior product.

buns

This - Simples !!

y) y) y)

I too am dissapointed with this change, but its not the end of the world. One point that hasn't been mentioned is that maybe Virgin are doing this to remove the inconsistency of the premium product on the LGW/Man fleet. At present they have different seats, which will change, but downstairs is a small claustrophobic area of 2 or 3 rows. By making more of PE section downstairs they maybe want to remove the complaints of people who haven't got a seat upstairs.

My biggest surprise is the lack of the new UCS - I find it very odd - unless they are tight on cash.

As to comments that SRB needs to 'sort it out' across a number of forums. He has no involvement in the airline now - spends most of his time on Necker in semi retirement. He turns up for PR events and is probably briefed what to say when he arrives. I expect he has no idea about this.

First post for me on these forums having lurked here for quite a long time! Nice site!

I haven't read the entire thread in detail but I understand the dissapointment PE pax feel with the changes - my first flights with Virgin were PE in the bubble and it definitely was the best PE experience you could have. I still know many people who fly Virgin PE and would not consider anything else because of how much they valued the bubble seating, the space and the better service that comes from being in a smaller cabin. I'm sure that those people will now look at ALL options rather than just booking VS at any price.

Personally though, having been flying UC returns 2-3x a year, I'm waaay more disappointed about the news regarding UC. I've lost count of the number of conversations I've had with cabin crew about how 'tired' the MAN UCSs have been for the last 3 or 4 years. I held in there believing that change was just around the corner but to hear now that the proposal is to give all other pax on the plane a spanky new experience and us UC pax a 'deep clean' is beyond a joke.

Whilst I usally fly ex MAN because (a) I live 30mins from MAN and (b) the MAN destinations suit me better because I have family who live in Naples, FL and I do business in Colorado (making the Vegas flight a nice connection hub), I've also flown ex LHR lots of times to lots of other US destinations and I have to say that UC ex LHR is a compeltely different product to UC ex MAN - PP, dedicated security, the CH and the generally much better condition of UCS on predominently Airbus planes makes me frustrated every time I travel ex MAN and know what 'could be'. The promise/hope of at least a new UCS on the MAN 747's was at least something to hold on to....

This news makes me feel as though VS really do see us MAN/LGW pax as 'second rate citizens' despite the fact that we almost always fill UC (even when the rest of the plane is only half full as it was on my flight back from MCO just this week). And despite an earlier suggestion that we pay less for UC ex MAN, I would have to disagree - whilst we should undoubtedly pay less given the difference in product, I haven't noticed any/a significant differnce between flights I've taken ex LHR or ex MAN (albeit then when you fly different routes from the two airports it's hard to compare apples to apples).

So it would appear that VS expect us to be happy to continue enjoying this inferior product and show loyalty to our old battered (but 'deep cleaned'!!) J cabin whilst the rest of the plane gets a spanky new refit....

I wonder how that's going to work out for them....?

!

Not sure how the new JAM ife will fit into old UCS? There will have to be some changes to the suite surely as the screen and handset are completely different? Think it's going to need more than just a deep clean.

First post for me on these forums having lurked here for quite a long time!

Welcome, and I completely agree with you. I'm still holding out for the official version ...

Not sure how the new JAM ife will fit into old UCS? There will have to be some changes to the suite surely as the screen and handset are completely different?

Which is a good point, ummm .

[mitchja]

That's a good point actually about JAM IFE and the current UCS....as how will a touch screen LCD work when the screen housing is not fixed and is movable (often very loose as well) ?

Having to hold the screen housing just to touch the screen to select options is not going to be fun at all.

Yeah, tbh I didn't even want to go there....but now that you all have, shall we start a pot on it being an install by the cleaners after their spiff using an assortment of hammers, string and some sticky backed plastic?

After all, if it's a bodge it's not that bad because it'll only be in the old upper class suite(tm) !

)

I just want to clear up this thing about Virgin Holidays and the Upper deck. Yes, they get pre-reserved seating, but you can only reserve these seats if you book over the phone with VHols directly and the seats must be pre-booked on the same day the booking is made.

Book by any other channel (including booking direct online or via a travel agent) and you cannot reserve these seats at all, you only get to pick the same PE seats as anyone else booking a VS flight.

Also if you book over the phone out of the 11 month flight booking window, again these seats are not available to you.

Not really a benefit that many customers are actually going to be able to make use of!

For interest, today I spoke to one of the Virgin Holiday agents who works in a Concession outlet in my local Debenhams store.

I said I was a bit confused about the details printed in their current Florida brochures which are on-sale for holidays up to August 2013. I referred to the page which states "Premium Economy on the Upper Deck". I asked how, bearing in mind there are LGW & Manchester refits happening shortly which might affect the PE cabins, VH can state that 'if a customer books a 4 or 5v hotel and upgrades to PE then they can enjoy the experience of the upper deck'.

I was told they are working to the current printed brochure descriptions, so effectively they will still confirm seats will be in their "exclusive allocation on the Upper Deck". This will be for their PE customers who book to travel within the next 11 months. Any travel after that period, she said, the normal conditions apply ie the VH customer requests their seat via the VA website once their dates fall into the 11month period of time. At this point, it seems that the VH passenger is still guaranteed an Upper Deck seat.

Personally I feel there is one heck of a bonus in the future booking direct with Virgin Holidays if the new PE means significantly fewer seats on the Upper Deck.

Having to hold the screen housing just to touch the screen to select options is not going to be fun at all.

I guess there's a touch screen handset like in PE?

Personally I feel there is one heck of a bonus in the future booking direct with Virgin Holidays if the new PE means significantly fewer seats on the Upper Deck.

But you can't book flight only on VH

Personally I feel there is one heck of a bonus in the future booking direct with Virgin Holidays if the new PE means significantly fewer seats on the Upper Deck.

But you can't book flight only on VH

Very true, but my last comment was meant to indicate that any customers using VH will get the bonus of being given priority seating in the UD (only if they book 4 or 5v hotels in the package). If VS remove some PE rows from the 'bubble' it could be this Upper Deck choice is not open to all VS passengers which to me doesn't seem very fair.

I moved away from packaged holidays many years ago but alot of people still travel this way and by booking direct with VH they will benefit from the current VH Upper Deck policy. Its quite strange, this "PE on the Upper Deck" is only advertised in the Florida brochure so it would seem that on the other LGW or MAN flights this 'exclusive allocation' of seats does not apply.

Hev60 you make a good point - however, VH package holiday prices would more than likely be prohibitive...I still look at VH every now and again, got a (I think) good deal on accomm only recently, but in general terms I can save £500 plus by booking flights/accomm separately over the package with VH...and the bubbble is good, but not that good!

I was told they are working to the current printed brochure descriptions, so effectively they will still confirm seats will be in their "exclusive allocation on the Upper Deck". This will be for their PE customers who book to travel within the next 11 months.

Old cynic that I be, the brochure also says

Applies to selected Gatwick and Manchester departures on 747 aircraft only. Please note, this is subject to availability and change, Aircraft changes may not allow upper deck seating

That covers everything!!

I'm sure some of this information has already been shared a couple of months ago ):

Not sure if this has been cleared up from first few posts, 9+ pages couldn't be bothered to read through... but the UC section is being REFRESHED, not just a deep clean. All components stripped and replaced. Nice and new and shiney. Yay.

Not sure if this has been cleared up from first few posts, 9+ pages couldn't be bothered to read through... but the UC section is being REFRESHED, not just a deep clean. All components stripped and replaced. Nice and new and shiney. Yay.

Have I missed something? Who said it was 'REFRESHED' or that we were getting all new components??

Don't get me wrong, it would be a vast improvement on the 'deep clean' mentioned in the first post, but I don't recall seeing this mentioned in posts here?

/edit: and if indeed it is the old UCS design but with all new components including a redesigned/refitted IFE, well that is an entirely different set of facts to the OP.

I'd love to hear authoritative clarification!