EU 261 Compensation and Miles Offer

Hi all,

Was on the VS 16 on the 25th and we were delayed around 5 hours. I understand this is grounds for a compensation claim under EU 261. On landing we were given a letter not mentioning this, but that if we contacted customer services they would credit some FC miles to our account by means of an apology. Just wondering if we accepted the miles whether that would affect the EU 261 claim?

I'd also like to say Virgin were brilliant with the delay. First they tried to move us to an earlier flight (and I believe quite a few were able to be moved) however PE was full by the time we got to check in. Then they gave announcements every 15 minutes updating us on what was going on until the delay was known of 5 hours. Turned out a part was needed for a poorly Ruby Tuesday that had to be transported by road from Fort Lauderdale. We were given food vouchers, and once the cabin crew arrived they brought a trolley out from the aircraft and went round offering soft drinks to everyone! (a great touch I thought and never seen anyone else do this). The captain also introduced himself and kept us up to date on the tannoy. Delays are never ideal - but have to say I don't think anyone else handles them as well as I have experienced on this occasion. Well done to all the ground staff at MCO, as well as the crew of VS16 who were just simply brilliant from start to finish.

Steve

Yes a delay of 5 hours would be grounds for EU261 compensation and it appears that VS don't have a valid exemption from paying a claim.

So yes you can get €600 per passenger. BUT the regulation also makes provision for an airline - with the agreement of the passenger - to make an offer of a voucher credit or miles. But it it up to the passenger to chose which one they accept. Some US airlines for example offer an $800 credit against a future flight and BA has experimented with making offers of 50-60k avios.

To me the offer of miles was a customer service gesture and not an offer of compensation. The sooner you make the claim the sooner they will pay you.

On the same topic, what is the turnaround between making a claim and getting a payout?

We were on VS94 on the 21st which was delayed just over the 4 hours? Put my claim in the next day but haven't heard anything since?

Also another question regarding the 4 hours delay time - just out of interest, at what point do they judge the arrival is it upon landing or the time of arrival at the gate?

It was looking like we were going to be just under a 4 hour delay by a couple of minutes until we hit congestion above gatwick and had to circle for 15 minutes causing us to land just over 4 hours late, but say we had landed with delay as 3 hours 56 minutes but arrived at the gate at 4 hours 03 minutes would that have been classed as over or under 4 hours?

I assume it is gate arrival but just wondered ?

The time taken is doors open and people are able to disembark the plane. Merely just arriving at the gate does not stop the clock.

VS could make the case that if the ATC delay was what brought you over the 4 hours and so could deny you the full €600 but for a delay between 3 and 4 hours you'd qualify for €300

The flight left over 4 and a half hours late, and arrived at the gate well over 4 hours late, so not really sure congestion at peak time is "extraordinary circumstance" even if the flight was the shortest time over the last 3 months it would have gone over.

Pilot even announced the reason for having to land at peak time was due to the delay caused by the mechanical failure...

Departure time is neither here nor there.

With EU261 it is the difference between scheduled and actual arrival that matters (or to be more accurate doors open and passengers can disembark).

Airlines can and do analyse the cause of delay so if say 15 minutes can be attributed to ATC (which is extraordinary whether you like it or not) then that gets knocked off the time and if that takes you under 4 hours then tough.

But as I said a delay of between 3 and 4 hours gets you 50% of the amount.

I appreciate your input, before the delay was announced our scheduled ETA was given as 20 or so minutes earlier than scheduled 10:30 would this also have any bearing? Or is it the previously advised scheduled time of 10:30?

Also Virgin website lists the flights duration as 9hrs 35m yet this flight had a total travel time of 9hrs 13m?

EC261/2004 delay compensation is measured by the difference between doors open and the scheduled arrival time as stated on your booking. Any estimated arrival time given out by the flight crew before the delay is neither here nor there.

Well the wait is over, €600(£540) x 3 approved...... .

Hi,
I probably know the answer already but here goes.....
I booked through a UK agent for recent flights to Tampa and flew from Manchester with VS to New York and had a change of flight to Tampa with Delta (VS Codeshare flight number)
Whilst in the delightful terminal 2 at JFK our flight kept getting later and later, eventually taking off 8 hours late, which after a 7 hour flight from Manchester was not great!
The flight was late partly because of the weather, but at one point we did board the plane, taxi round JFK for an hour before returning to the stand as the crew would breach hours.
Eventually we did take off from New York with another crew......
I assume we are not entitled to any compensation under EU261 or anything similar as it was the Delta flight which was delayed despite it being a through ticket from MAN to TPA.

Hi,
I probably know the answer already but here goes.....
I booked through a UK agent for recent flights to Tampa and flew from Manchester with VS to New York and had a change of flight to Tampa with Delta (VS Codeshare flight number)
Whilst in the delightful terminal 2 at JFK our flight kept getting later and later, eventually taking off 8 hours late, which after a 7 hour flight from Manchester was not great!
The flight was late partly because of the weather, but at one point we did board the plane, taxi round JFK for an hour before returning to the stand as the crew would breach hours.
Eventually we did take off from New York with another crew......
I assume we are not entitled to any compensation under EU261 or anything similar as it was the Delta flight which was delayed despite it being a through ticket from MAN to TPA.

Sorry to say but your suspicions are correct, as this was a delayed domestic DL flight the EU261 rules don't apply.
You may wish to reach out to Delta though to request some compensation, they may through some vouchers your way.

If this was booked as a single ticket, surely it is your arrival at the ticketed destination that counts, so I reckon you are due the compensation. If it was two tickets then no. But you do say "through ticket" so start your claim with VS.

If this was booked as a single ticket, surely it is your arrival at the ticketed destination that counts

That’s my reading of EC261/2004 as well.

However if the delay was caused by bad weather, no compensation would be due.

I went down that route before, flight was LHR to SFO all booked and ticketed by Virgin but there was a Delta connection LAX to SFO that got cancelled. Neither airline would pay out on EC261, eventually even tried with one of the companies who do it for you for a cut and they declined it too.

Thanks for your replies guys.

I have emailed customer services at Delta.....the whole situation was handled badly. Terminal 2 at JFK is not a nice place to spend the best part of 10 hours!! Especially when everything closed up

What started as a hour or so delay due to weather.....and yes it was raining......turned into a much longer delay. Weather, crew and air traffic control.

Anyway, I'll see what, if anything, they say!

[mitchja]

Do be warned - Delta is utterly atrocious for customer service as all their European email queries and calls are outsourced and dealt with by Air France/KLM from their European service centre.

I sincerely hope VS never go down this same route

The only decent customer service from Delta comes from contacting them using their US numbers and US contact details. @Delta on Twitter are pretty good as another route to contact them too.

Yep can only echo those statements re Delta CS. In my above example I was basically left stranded at LAX overnight with no info from Delta about hotels or food or anything They had rerouted me the next day on a 3 stop (!!!!!!!) journey from LAX to SFO. Needless to say I didn't take them up and instead hired a car and drove there overnight as I had a meeting first thing.

I pursued them online and they tend not to reply then weeks later they'll send you a travel voucher so I ended up with 2 vouchers for $150 each about 6 months later. I then eventually mailed their CEO detailing the incident and the customer service asking for reimbursement for the car hire and a motel I stopped at for a few hours and they coughed up the $400 odd to my bank account at this point.

As background, my flight was cancelled for weather as there were heavy storms in SFO, so it was basically the incoming aircraft was not there to take us back. I argued both that a) the weather was fine in LAX and b) for an airline not to be liable for compensations the weather has to be "freak or wholly exceptional" - I argued that rain in San Fran in January was neither of those.