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#961882 by dmc
03 Jul 2023, 13:10
Does anyone know how Upper Class TPs are supposed to be awarded on upgrades?

I have noticed if I pay cash for, say, a PE fare, and use a credit card voucher to upgrade to Upper, I only receive 50TP (the original amount I would have received in PE). But if I book a PE reward seat with points and use a credit card voucher to upgrade to Upper, I receive 100TP (as I would if I had purchased a full UC reward with points). Is that how it's supposed to work?
#961885 by jimbowimbo
03 Jul 2023, 18:53
I’m also confused as if I upgrade a PE fare to G with points I get 100 TP
However this isn’t the norm, I do this 5 or 6 times a year and I’d say at least a third of the time I get miles and no TP points…! It’s mean to be one of the other but I guess another example of Virgin IT!
#961892 by CommanderB
03 Jul 2023, 21:38
You’re only supposed to get Tier Points for the underlying fare in both scenarios.

However.

Quite often, the system just sees G as the fare bucket and rewards 100 points because reward fares (not upgrades) get 100 points and it isn’t able to tell the difference. If you ring, they’ll manually adjust it if you so desire.

When you buy a cash ticket and upgrade later using points, nowadays the system usually works out the correct (underlying) points to award. It didn’t always do this and it does still occasionally get it wrong.

An interesting thing that’s happening at the moment is when you book a PE fare and upgrade immediately using points or the voucher as part of the same transaction, it never gets ticketed as PE, it gets immediately ticketed as Upper Reward and thus always gets the 100 tier points. The only way of deciphering this after the fact is explaining to whoever has to fix it to correct the points that it can’t possibly be a straight reward fare due to the total amount paid in cash far exceeds the reward fare taxes & fees in most cases. On paper it looks like a straight reward fare whereas if you ticketed it as PE, wait a day, then do the upgrade it would look different on the backend.

Classic VS IT.

(You can tell I deal with this a lot…) :-D
#961893 by dmc
03 Jul 2023, 23:25
CommanderB wrote:An interesting thing that’s happening at the moment is when you book a PE fare and upgrade immediately using points or the voucher as part of the same transaction, it never gets ticketed as PE, it gets immediately ticketed as Upper Reward and thus always gets the 100 tier points.


That's interesting, I didn't understand this inconsistency before but it explains why some of my previous bookings have been awarded this way and not others, the difference has been when I did the upgrade, exactly as you point out.
#961894 by CommanderB
04 Jul 2023, 10:02
dmc wrote:
CommanderB wrote:An interesting thing that’s happening at the moment is when you book a PE fare and upgrade immediately using points or the voucher as part of the same transaction, it never gets ticketed as PE, it gets immediately ticketed as Upper Reward and thus always gets the 100 tier points.


That's interesting, I didn't understand this inconsistency before but it explains why some of my previous bookings have been awarded this way and not others, the difference has been when I did the upgrade, exactly as you point out.


They will sort it out manually if you ring up. (You can't use the web form because that just see's a G fare and the computer says no).

It's a case of whether you want more incorrect Tier Points or the correct underlying points. Theres pros and cons to both.

If VS had a separate fare bucket for Upper reward vs Upgrade, that would fix this. Although BA IT is able to decipher easily and they use a single reward fare bucket too. Not that I'd say BA IT is the gold standard..........
#961896 by dmc
04 Jul 2023, 11:00
CommanderB wrote:They will sort it out manually if you ring up. (You can't use the web form because that just see's a G fare and the computer says no).

It's a case of whether you want more incorrect Tier Points or the correct underlying points. Theres pros and cons to both.

If VS had a separate fare bucket for Upper reward vs Upgrade, that would fix this. Although BA IT is able to decipher easily and they use a single reward fare bucket too. Not that I'd say BA IT is the gold standard..........


Thanks - so in the case where you buy a cash PE fare, later upgraded with points or voucher to Upper resulting in credit of 50TP + points, there's a way to have this adjusted to 100TP with no points? (as well as vice versa if the upgrade+purchase were done in one transaction)

I'm sure I had a long argument with them last year about one case of this where I only had 50TP credited (with PE level points) on a PE cash fare upgraded with points, and got nowhere. But perhaps it's a case of finding the right person to speak to!
#961897 by CommanderB
04 Jul 2023, 12:19
dmc wrote:
CommanderB wrote:They will sort it out manually if you ring up. (You can't use the web form because that just see's a G fare and the computer says no).

It's a case of whether you want more incorrect Tier Points or the correct underlying points. Theres pros and cons to both.

If VS had a separate fare bucket for Upper reward vs Upgrade, that would fix this. Although BA IT is able to decipher easily and they use a single reward fare bucket too. Not that I'd say BA IT is the gold standard..........


Thanks - so in the case where you buy a cash PE fare, later upgraded with points or voucher to Upper resulting in credit of 50TP + points, there's a way to have this adjusted to 100TP with no points? (as well as vice versa if the upgrade+purchase were done in one transaction)

I'm sure I had a long argument with them last year about one case of this where I only had 50TP credited (with PE level points) on a PE cash fare upgraded with points, and got nowhere. But perhaps it's a case of finding the right person to speak to!


From this page.

*A, P and G tier points earning is only applicable to full points reward flights and companion bookings. If you upgraded from a revenue fare to a higher cabin with points, your account will be credited with the tier points and Virgin Points based on your original revenue class.

As I say, there are situations where you can buy a cash PE fare, upgrade using points or a voucher and you get 100 Tier Points. This is incorrect. You can have it manually adjusted if it suits you, or you can quietly say nothing and enjoy the extra Tier Points. You CANNOT ring them and say "I'd like 100 Tier Points and no Virgin Points please". As much as I love negotiating with VS staff (usually around Op-Ups), this isn't one of those times. It's black and white. You can have the correct underlying points or the incorrect points, not a combination of both.

If you buy a cash PE fare + upgrade, sometimes they credit correctly and sometimes they don't. As to whether you chase them up or not about that, it's up to you.

Remember that PE fare buckets K and H earn 50 TP's each way. S and W earn 100 TP's each way. Just to add a further confusing variable around the number 100 :-D
#961898 by dmc
04 Jul 2023, 13:37
CommanderB wrote:
*A, P and G tier points earning is only applicable to full points reward flights and companion bookings. If you upgraded from a revenue fare to a higher cabin with points, your account will be credited with the tier points and Virgin Points based on your original revenue class.

As I say, there are situations where you can buy a cash PE fare, upgrade using points or a voucher and you get 100 Tier Points. This is incorrect. You can have it manually adjusted if it suits you, or you can quietly say nothing and enjoy the extra Tier Points. You CANNOT ring them and say "I'd like 100 Tier Points and no Virgin Points please".


Yep, thanks for the clarification :-) And I can confirm that last point doesn't work as I tried it and failed last year - only due to the confusion of sometimes being credited 100 and sometimes 50! (Had I known at the time the upgrade date is what causes the difference I wouldn't have questioned it).

Thanks for the tips; always learning useful insights here!
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