What's the point......

....In booking you normal and favourite seat in PE for a 10hr flight, just for a 4person family to take it at check-in.

I was told by a VS check-in member that my seat is never guaranteed and that we (VS) can re-seat you at any time. When I asked why, I was plainly told that a family wanted to sit in the area I had reserved my seat. It was obvious to me that they wanted 4seats in PE and were willing to pay top $ for them.

My seat had been reserved for over 5months and the last day before the flight I was still there (with 3seats around me). So I had the pleasure of being moved beside probably one of the noisiest pair of kids, with parents that did not care one bit about the racket they made.

Is an email to VS worth the time? Or shall I just decide whether spending more money to keep Au and VS loyalty is worth it, when they obviously do not keep the same loyalty to myself when top dollar is waived in front of them.

(A normally) Always Chilled.

[Bazz]

Unfortunately this can and does happen, you should think of it as a seat request and not a reservation. It is not possible to reserve a specific seat, all manner of circumstances can mean your preferred seat is no longer available and airlines will always make every effort to seat families together whenever possible. You could try emailing VS but don't be disappointed if they simple refer you to the T&Cs.

in some respects i wonder why VS bother to allow pre assignment of seats. When it goes wrong it always seems to look like a poor management of expectations...

BA no longer allow seats to be pre-assigned. perhaps VS should follow the lead?

[HighFlyer]

Originally posted by barnstaple
BA no longer allow seats to be pre-assigned. perhaps VS should follow the lead?

Ag and Au Exec Club members can still pre-book.

I like the ability to pre-book a seat but perhaps VS need to make a bigger statement that these are requests and not binding in any way, shape or form in order to avoid disappointment.

Thanks,
Sarah

This has been one of a few recent threads discussing this or similar occurrences. Whilst I fully understand that pre assigned seating is merely a request and that iaw VS T&C's, the airline reserves the right to change seating for 'operational reasons'. It is quite obvious that in this instance a commercial decision was taken to maximise profits. Not a problem as far as I am concerned, after all this is the sole reason why they are in business. However, I believe that VS should make the terms and conditions of pre booking seating a lot clearer on the appropriate section of their website and not leave this information tucked away in a section, ie T&C's, few people bother to access. This would help to alleviate customer disappointment.

Regards
Bryan

There is also a strong argument that if a change is done for purely commercial reasons, there should be some compensation (miles) for the pax suffering the change.
Even a token amount would help and avoid the inevitable complaint (probably followed by 5,000 miles anyway)

Originally posted by Bill S
There is also a strong argument that if a change is done for purely commercial reasons, there should be some compensation (miles) for the pax suffering the change.
Even a token amount would help and avoid the inevitable complaint (probably followed by 5,000 miles anyway)

Bill,
what strong argument? [:?]

Regards
Bryan

[buns]

Even if there was a commercial justification, I would suspect that the majority of agents in the check in melee would resort to the 'family in need' routine as they would have little or no idea why the seat has been allocated elsewhere.

buns

I agree with all these comments. Under the current system expectations don't seem to be managed effectively - I can understand why people end up under the misaprehension that their preassigned seat is 'booked' for them!

[honey lamb]

I was told by a VS check-in member that my seat is never guaranteed and that we (VS) can re-seat you at any time. When I asked why, I was plainly told that a family wanted to sit in the area I had reserved my seat. It was obvious to me that they wanted 4seats in PE and were willing to pay top $ for them.

I am at a loss to know how you knew that they were willing to pay top $ for these seats? [?]

You state that on the day before the flight your booking was still there with 3 seats around it. If that was the case and a family wanted/needed to be together then logically the most expedient thing to do was to move the single person. You do not mention the ages of the family but if there were children there, then FAA regulations state that families must be seated together.

From time to time people have posted, especially in the case of families, about the lack of seats available for pre-allocation because the 60% has been reached and the advice given on this forum has been to try OLCI as soon as it opens or to get to the airport early when more seats will be released. It has been stated that VS will try at all stages to keep families together. Unfortunately this advice seems to have worked against you in this instance. [:#]

Originally posted by sixdownkeepsafedepth

Originally posted by Bill S
There is also a strong argument that if a change is done for purely commercial reasons, there should be some compensation (miles) for the pax suffering the change.
Even a token amount would help and avoid the inevitable complaint (probably followed by 5,000 miles anyway)

Bill,
what strong argument? [:?]

Bryan,
My point was regarding 'purely commercial reasons' as distinct from operational reasons.
If an operational reason is not given (such as 'for safety, we must sit children with parents') then the passenger is going to feel both annoyed and inconvenienced. A token recompense takes away the 'sting' - it leaves the customer feeling better. It is simply good business.
A far better way, however, is to ensure that operational reasons (such as seems likely in this particular case) are explained.
Far too many customers have recently become upset over VS seat 'bookings'. It is an issue.
I would far rather see a sensitive approach to improve matters rather than have the risk of a marked reduction in the number of seat 'bookings' available.

Regards,
Bill

Originally posted by Always Chilled
....In booking you normal and favourite seat in PE for a 10hr flight, just for a 4person family to take it at check-in.

Was PE fairly full? The reason I ask is that it is my understanding that there is a CAA regulation that airlines must make every effort for families to sit together.

http://www.virgin-atlantic.com/en/gb/faq/preassignedseats.jsp

If it makes you feel any better, about ten years ago on a Northwest flight LGW-DTW in J I was asked on boarding if I would mind moving from my pre-assigned window seat. I declined as the alternative wasn't to my liking, and then the FA went off in a huff. Of course, what they didn't tell me that I would end up sitting next to a brat, at which point I gladly moved. The FA continued to berate me, and didn't understand that had she explained the situation I would have moved.

Howard

Thanks for some very interesting replies. This is the first chance I've had to check the site and I understand now that my seat reserved online is not a 'done deal'. I also understand that putting families together is another priority.

So let me explain a little more about the situation I was unlucky to be part of. Trust me, I'm not making a mountain out of a mole hill, but when I have to get away from my re-allocated seat just to get 30mins of peace, you might have a little sympathy!

When I checked in and asked the supervisor, I was told that the original family of 4 upgraded for the flight and I was moved (I still had 3seats around me, I know this from an online check day before). Maybe I didn't make that clear on my 1st post. That's why I said money matters more that loyalty.

One of the things that happened when I told the supervisor that I wasn't too happy, was the option I was given for someone else (on the other side of the aircraft) to be moved for me! I mean please don't mess someone else around on top of me being told to up-sticks too.

The seat I was moved to, ended up to be THE nightmare we all hope never happens. The nightmare 4person family, Inc 2young children, seated over the isle from me were pure hell. The parents did not care and their un-disciplined children either screamed or ran riot in the area. By the way, an hour after take-off, the dad decided to go to sleep (a wise decision, wish I could have). So every once and a while I had to get up for a stretch and a chat with one a the great cabin crew girls at the back of the cabin. She was saying she was having a nightmare too and had told the parents to stop the kids from pulling window blinds up and down and switching the reading lights on and off.

So on the comments posted, I thank you. Yes, I do understand that the reserved seat is not nailed on. Yes, I understand that a family of 4 will always get priority and people will be moved.

I also notice that some of you think it is not made as clear to people that there may be a chance that your seat is allocated for someone else. Glad some of you can see through all the 'sorry sir' apologies when hard cash is waived under the noses of check-in staff too!!

Thanks again, I'll probably vent my last bit of steam via an email to VS.

(An almost chilled) Always Chilled.

Originally posted by Always Chilled
When I checked in and asked the supervisor, I was told that the original family of 4 upgraded for the flight and I was moved (I still had 3seats around me, I know this from an online check day before).

Whether they were upgraded or not, I don't believe that makes any difference to the application of the CAA regulation. Indeed, speculating, it may even have been that the reason they chose to upgrade the family rather than couples/individuals was to keep them together. However I would have thought some common sense might have suggested that upgrading such a group wasn't the brightest idea from the point of view of others who had paid a premium in the hope of avoiding such a scenario.

I agree that it is exceptionally irritating when you end up with brats like that. I suffered that last August on a VS flight NRT-LHR in J where a pair of kids spent the entire flight OD'd on Sunny D or something. The entire J cabin was denied any chance of sleep. In retrospect I really wish I'd said something, although on the very, very odd occasion that I bring myself to say something, I am in such a rage it invariably comes out with exceptional vitriol. It's the usual story, parents (sic) letting their brats run around screaming and irritating people, and not having the common decency to make any attempt to placate the little s***s.

H

Bryan,
My point was regarding 'purely commercial reasons' as distinct from operational reasons.
If an operational reason is not given (such as 'for safety, we must sit children with parents') then the passenger is going to feel both annoyed and inconvenienced. A token recompense takes away the 'sting' - it leaves the customer feeling better. It is simply good business.
A far better way, however, is to ensure that operational reasons (such as seems likely in this particular case) are explained.
Far too many customers have recently become upset over VS seat 'bookings'. It is an issue.
I would far rather see a sensitive approach to improve matters rather than have the risk of a marked reduction in the number of seat 'bookings' available.

Regards,
Bill

Bill,
thank you for expanding on your previous statement. I suppose the 'strong argument' that you mention, could be made by the likes of you and I. Of course a token recompense would take the string away and leave the customer with a 'rosy feeling' and would be construed by ourselves as simply good business sense. The perspective taken on the matter by VS would I suspect be very different! I think that in these tough financial times for airlines, even giving away a few air miles would be seen by the bean counters as a cardinal sin! I wonder if VS has had the LEAN mob in yet?

Regards
Bryan

Originally posted by Always Chilled

The seat I was moved to, ended up to be THE nightmare we all hope never happens. The nightmare 4person family, Inc 2young children, seated over the isle from me were pure hell. The parents did not care and their un-disciplined children either screamed or ran riot in the area. By the way, an hour after take-off, the dad decided to go to sleep (a wise decision, wish I could have). So every once and a while I had to get up for a stretch and a chat with one a the great cabin crew girls at the back of the cabin. She was saying she was having a nightmare too and had told the parents to stop the kids from pulling window blinds up and down and switching the reading lights on and off.

Families like this really really annoy me [V]

I travel regularly with my 3 girls aged 3, 9 and 10, they are no angels by any stretch of the imagination at home believe me BUT they do know how to behave on flights and low and behold them if they don't. It may make for a stressful flight for me to ensue my children behave and be quiet but i'd rather this than upset numerous other passengers.

I don't know whether or not i'm lucky but it isn't that difficult to keep children occupied on a flight providing you are prepared and I certainly can't see any justification for any parent allowing their children to run around a plane screaming [n]

Sorry you had such a lousy flight, not all families are the same as the nightmare one you encountered.