Virgin or BA loyalty?

Hi Everyone

Not sure if this is the right place to ask but thought I would try.

I currently have about 6000 miles with BA and just signed up to Flying Club. The question I had was whether I should concentrate on collecting BA or Flying Club miles... I would probably spend miles on flights to asia/africa/US rather than europe where budget airlines would suffice for me.

I am just about to start work as a doctor in August and plan on taking our a credit card to increase my miles earning. which one depends on which program I become loyal to (BA or Virgin Amex card).

Pros for Virgin:
I have family in Malaysia and thus fly SQ and MH about once a year

Cons for Virgin:
Looking around the forums it appears that people seem to think that BA miles rewards are better because there are fewer conditions?

Any advice?

p.s. I suppose I could always fly BA/Cathay to HK and then onto Malaysia...

[HighFlyer]

I guess the questions you need to ask yourself, as you have done, are; 'where do you fly to most often'?, 'what class'? and 'how often'?. If you are looking at collecting miles to save for leisure trips, you do not do a lot of European or business travel and most of your miles will come from credit card expenditure then I think VS may suit you better than BA.

BA has the obvious advantage of the short haul network (and more routes) but if you are primarily interested in getting to KUL on SQ and MZ then you can collect the miles from those airlines into your FC account which may work better for you.

BA do have a good rewards program in combination with the BA AmEx, if you'll spend over 10k a year and can trigger that 2-4-1 voucher then you may be able to take a luxury trip every year with BA. The 2-4-1 works with a reward flight, not a paid for flight like VS, so in that respect it is better, plus some of the 'lower' restricted BA fares, like some of the sale WT+/Club fares can also be upgraded with miles. Another bonus. While I find that BA often have good reward availibilty (at least for routes I am looking at) you must book direct with BA and you can only use miles to upgrade one class at a time (no Economy to Club upgrade for example) so this might be a limitation for you, depending on your miles balance and what class you want to fly. BA have a mileage program that rewards the frequent traveller, so booking a Club fare to SIN for example, you wont be able to pre-allocate a seat until OLCI, not unless you are BAEC Silver or higher.

I guess you have to look at these things and decide what works better for you? BAEC is attractive to me as I do a lot of European travel for work, if I didnt I would probably not look too much further than VS.

You could also look at Bmi and *A, just to throw another option out there [:)]

Thanks,
Sarah

Thanks for your reply Sarah, I do travel to europe for leisure. i just find that I always end up using ryannair or easyjet because of price. It sounds like Virgin is the way to go for me.
I also considered BMI and *A but I read somewhere that they are being bought up by Lufthansa? Plus MH isn't in *A. However I have heard that BMI miles go a lot further than VS or BA Miles...
Hmm....

[HighFlyer]

At the moment, the Bmi program is quite good, but yes I forsee more changes as LH move in as their own program doesnt support 'miles and money' in the way that Bmi do. We've already seen the redemptions for First increase and some other changes, but they do cover a lot of airlines and so have been a good program for many.

You'd probably do well to take out the VS AmEx card (black one) and collect your VS miles that way. If you spend with Virgin partners like VH and VS to get the bonus miles you'll start racking up soon enough. Just check the redemption history of the places you want to save up for. Some routes are much harder than others to find reward availibility, especially if you are resticted by the time of year that you can travel. Its well worth looking at this now before saving up the miles.

I assume to get to KUL you could fly to HKG or PVG and connect?

Thanks,
Sarah

I find BA works better for us as Leisure travelers.The Amex Premium + card gives you 1.5 miles on every plus double with BA and the very useful 241 voucher once a year on hitting 10k spend.We actually have 3 cards in the family so 3 vouchers a year is a real bonus.

The Household account is also a good feature if you have partner/family/children, all the flying miles effectively go into one pot as do the Amex 241 vouchers.The only downside is redemption's can only be for the people in the HH account.

The other great earner is converting Tesco club card vouchers into BA miles every 2.50 converts to 600 BA miles.Tesco is nowhere near the cash cow it once was but we are still getting 150k BA miles a year.That is 2x USA/South Africa F rtn flights when combined with the 241 voucher just for shopping at Tesco.

The ability to upgrade any WT+ paid fare(even sale fares) to CW for only 25k miles RTN is outstanding value as you even earn miles on the WT+ part of the fare.

Award availability is good on some routes and useless on others (BKK,SYD,GIG) but HKG is always good and CX have fantastic connections across the Far east.

Just lately BA have had a couple of unbelievable offers a 241 CW sale and the half miles redemption sale last year.These may never be repeated but then again who knows.

If you can climb through the EC tiers there are better earning rates lounge access, priority boarding and seat allocation perks.We achieve this by booking cheap CE/CW sale fares and plenty of domestic F travel on AA KUP(Y fares that upgrade at booking into F) fares.But in reality you only really need Silver and 600 TPs is not that hard to hit with a bit of planning.

Having said all that we had a number of happy years with VS but never achieved the same level of award travel as we do with BA.

Interesting. Yeah flying CX is always an option to Malaysia and Singapore.
One thing I noticed is the difference in earning from flights between BA and VS: I flew return to Mauritius on lowest economy with BA and earnt about 3000 miles. If i flew the same flight with VS I would earn 6000 miles...
Incidentally, junior doctors are paid pretty poorly and with my huge student loan debt of 6 years, i'm not sure I can justify paying 100+ pounds for a credit card. so would have to go with fee-free.
I fear I am no nearer to making a decision...

There is a little dodge with the BA amex P+ card, get a free Amex credit card the blue or plat credit card used to work ,hold it for 6 months then apply for the P+ and the fee is reduced to 30.Its also free with the Plat charge card which at 300 is a no brainer for me even though I never use it,as it covers all the families travel insurance costs for a start.

BA does reward you less for flying on el cheapy tickets.You have to wait for the WT+ sale fares.

thank jaguarpig, so i'm guessing you collect on BA miles only these days? Maybe BA would be more suitable for me then. Do people collect on both BA and VS schemes or is that pointless?

[HighFlyer]

It depends how much flying you do. I collect on BA, VS an BD but I fly a fair bit. If you only fly those airlines a few times a year then it makes much more sense to collect miles in one place as they will build up quicker.

Thanks,
Sarah

quote:Originally posted by DocMark
thank jaguarpig, so i'm guessing you collect on BA miles only these days? Maybe BA would be more suitable for me then. Do people collect on both BA and VS schemes or is that pointless?


Hi DocMark,

I collect both miles on BA and VS ( although I tend to fly with BA more these days)

However when I was looking for a redemption ticket to SFO/LAX for a trip in 2 weeks ( leaving 4th July returning 11th July) BA had no availability whatsovever where has VS did have some -earlier today there was availability to both SFO/LAX but when it came to booking, there was no availability on the SFO-LHR run so I chose to return via LAX ( outbound to SFO).

As HighFlyer mentioned if oyu only do a little bit of flying each year then it is probably better to concentrate in one programme ( if you have lots of miles then amybe 2 programmes)

Regards

TBS

[preiffer]

Have to say, I've been looking at BA redemptions for SFO during ANY of July/Aug/Sept (and sometimes Oct) and have had NOTHING on offer since the start of May [n]

I guess the half price miles sale hammered their (previously extensive) availability....

Is it true BA allow you to use miles to upgrade WT+ sale fares? If only VS would do the same for their PE K fares, I would deffo stick to VS for life.

Now BA have introduced the Vegas route, I really may switch. Until now the routes I fly were operated by both airlines, with the exception of Vegas. Hmmmm, decision time.

quote:Originally posted by kingcole1974
Is it true BA allow you to use miles to upgrade WT+ sale fares? If only VS would do the same for their PE K fares, I would deffo stick to VS for life.
Yep any BA.com purchased WT+ fare is now upgradable to J for 25K miles rtn,they included the cheap sale fares sometime last year.

quote:Originally posted by DocMark
thank jaguarpig, so i'm guessing you collect on BA miles only these days? Maybe BA would be more suitable for me then. Do people collect on both BA and VS schemes or is that pointless?

We concentrate on BA/OW now, have no VS miles left and just recently managed to burn our BMI miles.We probably could split our flying up to earn worthwhile miles in both BA and VS FF programmes but wouldn't be able to keep BA gold status.

Thanks for all the replies but from what I can gather, there is no clear winner between BA and VS for my situation....
and most people can list pros and cons for both schemes. I guess something/someone will sway me at some point. Anyone think I should really be considering one and not the other?

From the sound of things you are like me flying to the Far East once/twice a year on the cheapest economy fare. VS used to be very good on that front with 12,000 miles on a HKG return so in effect fly 5 times get 1 free but this has now been trimmed by 50%. So now you will need to fly 10 times to achieve the 60,000 miles reward for HKG. From that point of view, you might consider not joining any frequent flyer programme and just fly with whoever offer you the cheapest flights.

quote:Originally posted by sky0000547
you might consider not joining any frequent flyer programme and just fly with whoever offer you the cheapest flights.


I think thats the best advice, because if Docmark is on a tight budget joining a FF program will only twist perceptions on whats the best value to go on as rewards would really be very few & far between in terms off reward flights.

cheers

alex[:)]

I understand the reasoning behind not sticking doggedly to one particular airline. Obviously cost will be what determines my choice for the next few years. but since i use a credit card extensively I wanted to get something back for it and want to apply for either the BA or Virgin Amex. the miles from that would go towards a FF program. That is really the big reason I want to focus on one program (but using other airlines if a particular flight to a particular destination is obviously cheaper).

quote:Originally posted by DocMark
Thanks for all the replies but from what I can gather, there is no clear winner between BA and VS for my situation....
and most people can list pros and cons for both schemes. I guess something/someone will sway me at some point. Anyone think I should really be considering one and not the other?


This is my experience of Executive Club and Virgin - I am an extremely infrequent flyer with both. 2 flights with Virgin last year, 2 coming up 12 months later, and maybe 4-6 cheap flights a year with British Airways... *Your Experience May Vary*

From the outset, I would say, join up. But you can still shop on price.


BRITISH AIRWAYS Executive Club
- 125 miles per flight - because I book the cheapest flights on short routes and I don't book based on what future miles I may earn.
- 1000 miles via American Express registration
- 600 miles on Amex spend
- 840 miles from Tesco Clubcard (I don't leave near a major Tesco, believe it or not)
- 16 miles via iTunes and BA Store.

So, in the space of about 18 months, I have accrued just over 3000 miles. They'll sit there and grow at a very slow rate, as my travel is nearly always discretionary, and for no real reason other than to see a place for the day, so Ryanair at 10 return inc. taxes will always suit me. (If I am not travelling with luggage etc.)

VIRGIN ATLANTIC Flying Club
- One US return flight - 6725 miles (the fare was about 480 return)
- One Miles More Friends recommendation - 2000 miles
- One Miles More Friends recommendation - 6000 miles (they upped to UC inbound!!)
- Flying Club Shop bonus - 500 miles
- Flying Club spend - 580 miles

So, based on nothing more than a bog standard economy flight, and some gentle recommending to pals and a normal shop, I have got almost 16,000 miles.

I know which club I will be sticking with.

quote:Originally posted by Sealink




- 840 miles from Tesco Clubcard (I don't leave near a major Tesco, believe it or not)






But if you do live near Tesco 100k+ BA miles PA are very achievable.[:D]

Very true. I got those 840 miles based on about 3.50 of Clubcard points. Now if only Nectar would do something like that. Their current deal with eBookers is of the Miles plus Money kind... So no real saving at all.

quote:Originally posted by DocMark
I understand the reasoning behind not sticking doggedly to one particular airline. Obviously cost will be what determines my choice for the next few years. but since i use a credit card extensively I wanted to get something back for it and want to apply for either the BA or Virgin Amex. the miles from that would go towards a FF program. That is really the big reason I want to focus on one program (but using other airlines if a particular flight to a particular destination is obviously cheaper).

Amex is not the best of friends with many shops. Also since you fly so infrequently and the flights are determined by the airlines offering you the cheapest fares, why don't you apply for a cashback credit card instead of VS or BA Amex? The more you spend the more you get back.

Of course joining a frequent flyer programme is free so you still have your choices.

quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
But if you do live near Tesco 100k+ BA miles PA are very achievable.[:D]


Especially if you have a penchant for the '99 Bolly Grande Anne, currently accruing at the rate of 13,500 BA miles/bottle. And if you're lucky you get to drink even more on board.

H

quote:Originally posted by Howard Long
quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
But if you do live near Tesco 100k+ BA miles PA are very achievable.[:D]


Especially if you have a penchant for the '99 Bolly Grande Anne, currently accruing at the rate of 13,500 BA miles/bottle. And if you're lucky you get to drink even more on board.

H

For us Tesco plonk 3 for 10[:D]Not seen the 99 Bolly in F for quite a while its the 99 Pol at the moment, there is plenty of Bolly in the CCR and the T5 F lounge, just hope its out in the T4 gate 1 lounge on Saturday.

How do you earn 13,500 BA miles on a 56.99 bottle of Bolly.At the 600 exchange rate I make 13,500 BA miles equivalent to 5625 Tesco spend assuming no voucher codes.Am I missing a trick here[?]

quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
How do you earn 13,500 BA miles on a 56.99 bottle of Bolly.At the 600 exchange rate I make 13,500 BA miles equivalent to 5625 Tesco spend assuming no voucher codes.Am I missing a trick here[?]


I've just spent the last 15 minutes trying to work that out too. Whilst I'm no huge fan of Tesco and don't have one close by, there is one, sort of, on the way home and buying BA miles at that rate, eith bubbly thrown in for free, would be a no brainer.

quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
quote:Originally posted by Sealink




- 840 miles from Tesco Clubcard (I don't leave near a major Tesco, believe it or not)






But if you do live near Tesco 100k+ BA miles PA are very achievable.[:D]


Or you could do something thats makes you feel good by avoiding tesco and shopping in your local butchers & bakers etc etc, which will help your community and keep your high street from all but vanishing.[:)]

cheers

alex