Your chance to ask questions of a Baggage Bod!

And if you have any questions for a 'baggage bod', them maybe I can help (so long as you don't ask too many secrets!).


Actually, as 'YellowSnow' has already mentioned, such delays have a massive knock-on effect. We get a hard time of it too.

About 20 minutes before arrival we head off to the stand to meet the aircraft, based upon the stand-number given to us 'by the computer'. We gather all the relevant equipment and make our way there at varying speeds, hopefully to arrive before the aircraft.
And we get there and find that there is already an aircraft on-stand. It's still being loaded, and we can see how much is left to load and (therefore) how long it will take. Then we see the VS flight land, taxy-in, and wait patiently.
And then it happens - we get a message saying that the Stand has changed. Occasionally we are lucky and it is a nearby stand, but that's rare. It is usually at the other end of T3 or (hell on earth) T5.
We then all set-off for the new stand, all that equipment moving at different speeds - think 'Whacky Races'!

Departures work slightly differently (for us). I'd like to say that we're there 'on time' 100% but I'd be lying. But we're there a very high percentage of the time. But then we have to wait for the cargo trucks to arrive ... and they're held-up at the security posts. And more often than not, they arrive in the wrong order!
And we have to wait for the baggage bins to arrive. Sometimes they arrive late because of late passenger arrivals at check-in.
So we get it all loaded in time, and the doors are closed about 10-15 mins before push. Then we get a message that there's an off-load! Aaaargh!! A passenger bag has been loaded, but the passenger has not, so the bag can't fly. What do you think the chances are of that bag being in the very last baggage bin to be loaded? Open the doors and start unloading stuff to get to the right bin, look through the bin for the bag (usually in the dark!). By now, we've missed our push back time, so we're blocking the stand, so something else is waiting for our stand, and so on. And, usually because somebody has 'over-indulged' in the bar and fallen asleep (I kid you not); or could not find the correct gate; or is delayed between terminals; or held-up at security (ooh, look, it's them again!); or is arguing the toss over an upgrade; or wants to carry their double bass (in a case) on their lap during the flight (really!).
Eventually it's all sorted and we close up. But now in the cul-de-sac there's 3 other aircraft all flashing and waiting to push, and Yellow Snow and his merry band are working like one-armed wall-paper hangars trying to sort out the mess.

AND RELAX!!!!

[Decker]

Very kind sir! BRB

[Decker]

OK Biggles...

LHR has to have the worst priority baggage handling of any place I fly into and yet you are COMPLETELY dependant on how it is loaded at the other end. What's the scoop? (The fact it's quicker at the other end shows you peeps are getting it right!)

Decker, do you mean baggage from arriving flight, or baggage on departing flights.

Whatever I tell you is only going to relate to T3, and especially Virgin, so if you're flying with somebody else, or to another terminal, I may not be able to help.

On arriving flights ...
The baggage (at the other end) is loaded in a certain sequence - 'Y' first, then 'Premium', then 'Upper', then 'Transfers'. When we open the doors we see the baggage bins, and the first ones off will be/should be for Transfer passengers.
They go off first (and we get rated on how quickly we deliver them to the Transfer baggage belt), and once they're on the belt they are no longer our responsibility. We have dedicated people who do this, and only this.

Next off is the Upper bin(s); the people who take these only take these, so there's no waiting. Straight down to the baggage belt, announce their arrival (gets the belt started), and put them on the belt. Job done, back for tea and biscuits. We have dedicated people who do this, and only this.
Next off are the Premium bins; they go to exactly the same belt, but usually a few 'Y' bins go with them.
Finally, all the remaining 'Y' bins. Drag them out two at a time, load them onto the carts, and drive them off to the belt.

It does happen (busy periods, every day, 6am-9am) that all the belts are busy, so we can't start unloading until a belt is allocated to us, and we can't start unloading until that belt is clear of previous bags. So we just have to wait! Which means that you don't get your bags. Not good, but speak to BAA!

If they DON'T load it that way at the other end (it does happen), then we have to untangle the mess when we unload the aircraft at Heathrow.

[Decker]

VS Arriving... I almost never get priority when UC or Au... but your explanation helps thanks! (And it adds to my trivia knowledge!).

I never even imagined there were separate crews per bin type.

Thanks for the inside info - very interesting.

[honey lamb]

Thanks, Biggles, that was really interesting

quote:Originally posted by Decker
VS Arriving... I almost never get priority when UC or Au... but your explanation helps thanks! (And it adds to my trivia knowledge!).


What I've noticed happen, and this was confirmed to me by the SFO station manager, is that even though your bag is tagged Upper/Premium at check-in, the cardboard tag can sometimes be pulled off in the airport baggage system.

Because the bag sorting into classes for loading is done by eyeballing the cardboard tag at stations such as SFO (I understand it's all automatic, based on the bag number at LHR - the system will know that is an Upper/Premium/Au bag), if the cardboard tag has come off before it makes it down to being sorted and loaded into bins, then it ends up being treated as a Y bag.

On my travels, I've noticed various labelling different methods used for this, and the Star Alliance method seems one of the most reliable:

* They stick a priority 'flag' into the printed bag tag before closing it up. So, rather than being on a flimsy piece of elastic, it has a much firmer attachment to the bag.
* They also print the word 'PRIORITY' in white type on black print, on the printed bag tag label, so even if the bright orange flag is torn off, as long as the main bag tag is still attached, it's visible.

Cheers,
Mike

Cheers Biggles,

nice to know from my lofty perch also !!

I usually travel PE between Manchester or Gatwick and Orlando apart from once when I was upped to Club from Manchester. When I return to Gatwick, my luggage is always quick in arriving on the belt - after Upper, which is the way it should be. However, when I land at Manchester, my blood pressure goes slowly through the roof as I watch economy after economy being lifted off the belt while I wait and wait and wait - last time was a full hour. It's not that the cases haven't been offloaded as they are on the belt - just not in the order which I paid 400 extra for - PE before Economy. If I was Economy, I would be delighted at the service, but as PE, I am disgusted, but too tired to do anything but moan and mutter to myself. Anybody got any suggestions as to why this might happen. I suspect that they are not being loaded in the correct order at MCO (we use DTD check-in) and so are not offloaded first at this end. But that does not explain how they get it right at Gatwick.

Katie [?]

Katie (any anyone else ...)

I can't comment on how it happens at Gatwick, but at Heathrow ...

it sometimes happens that we have problems getting the 'Transfer' and 'Upper' baggage bins off the aircraft, and the 'Y' bins are ready to go. They're all being done by different people, so once the guys with the Y are ready they head off to the baggage hall. Meanwhile, we're struggling with the Trans/Upper bins and eventually get them off, and they head off to the baggage hall.

Down at the baggage hall, they know what time the plane landed, so they know what time to expect to see the baggage bins from the flight. And, they expect to see the 'Upper' first. If they don't arrive first, then they make the 'Y' guys wait their turn (and drive around the one-way system again!) until the 'Upper' bins arrive and start unloading.
Just occasionally, somebody from Virgin Baggage will appear, ask about a hold up, and suggest that we start with the 'Y' bags before the 'Upper' bags have arrived. But this is quite rare. We do our utmost to make sure that the 'Upper' bags are delivered first.

Also, when you get to the baggage belt, take a cursory glance at the bags already going around on the belt. Are they from your flight? If not, we're probably outside, waiting to unload, but we can't start until the 'old' bags are removed.

quote:Originally posted by katie666
I suspect that they are not being loaded in the correct order at MCO (we use DTD check-in) and so are not offloaded first at this end.


I think you might have hit the nail on the head by mentioning you use DTD check-in. It's been reported elsewhere that these remote check-in options are less than great at handling W/J pax.

quote:
But that does not explain how they get it right at Gatwick.


No, true. Might be something to do with the MAN flight's departure time against that of the LGW? Less time to sort the bags out into the right order, so they just get stuffed into bins in the order they arrived.

Mike

[Darren Wheeler]

It's a shame the airlines don't actually publicise how the baggage is prioritised. I know people who still think the later the bag gets checked in, the earlier it gets unloaded. Consequently they arrive at the airport as lat as possible.

[mitchja]

My question Biggles, is do you guys who load/unload baggage also load/unload the rest of the cargo as well?

If so how long does it actually take you to unload all the remining cargo [:?] I've often wondered how that side of things work as where I work we send quite a lot of chemicals by air freight (anything upto drums containing 250Kg) most of which can be loaded into passenger A/C (although certain items are too dangerous and have to go on cargo only aircraft which I guess you've seen those orange warning stickers with the man with a big hand on!)

Regards

quote:Originally posted by Biggles
Katie (any anyone else ...)

I can't comment on how it happens at Gatwick, but at Heathrow ...

it sometimes happens that we have problems getting the 'Transfer' and 'Upper' baggage bins off the aircraft, and the 'Y' bins are ready to go. They're all being done by different people, so once the guys with the Y are ready they head off to the baggage hall. Meanwhile, we're struggling with the Trans/Upper bins and eventually get them off, and they head off to the baggage hall.

Down at the baggage hall, they know what time the plane landed, so they know what time to expect to see the baggage bins from the flight. And, they expect to see the 'Upper' first. If they don't arrive first, then they make the 'Y' guys wait their turn (and drive around the one-way system again!) until the 'Upper' bins arrive and start unloading.
Just occasionally, somebody from Virgin Baggage will appear, ask about a hold up, and suggest that we start with the 'Y' bags before the 'Upper' bags have arrived. But this is quite rare. We do our utmost to make sure that the 'Upper' bags are delivered first.

Also, when you get to the baggage belt, take a cursory glance at the bags already going around on the belt. Are they from your flight? If not, we're probably outside, waiting to unload, but we can't start until the 'old' bags are removed.



That explains a lot to me - Thank You. I'll try & be more patient in future although it's not easy at stupid o'clock in the morning after an 8 hour flight.

Katie

quote:Originally posted by mitchja
My question Biggles, is do you guys who load/unload baggage also load/unload the rest of the cargo as well?

If so how long does it actually take you to unload all the remining cargo [:?] I've often wondered how that side of things work as where I work we send quite a lot of chemicals by air freight (anything upto drums containing 250Kg) most of which can be loaded into passenger A/C (although certain items are too dangerous and have to go on cargo only aircraft which I guess you've seen those orange warning stickers with the man with a big hand on!)



Mitchja,

yes, we do load and unload the cargo on all the flights.
On about 99% of the flight the baggage comes off first, then the cargo. To completely offload an aircraft takes between 30 minutes and 1 hour; it all depands upon what type of aircraft, how much there is, and whether the trucks are there waiting.

A 747 holds less than a 340-600. Some aircraft have faulty inter-plan systems, so getting the stuff out can be a problem. Some flights are not always full.

When we talk about 'cargo', it could also be Mail, or Courier, or 'real' cargo. They all go to different places at the airport, and sometimes we have to wait for the courier people because their bins or pallets are in front of the cargo, etc.

Actually, I have not seen those orange stickers you mention, because if I had we'd be loading dangerous cargo into a passenger aircraft. But I am aware of them.

[mitchja]

Thanks Biggles [y]

Regards

quote:Originally posted by Biggles
Also, when you get to the baggage belt, take a cursory glance at the bags already going around on the belt. Are they from your flight? If not, we're probably outside, waiting to unload, but we can't start until the 'old' bags are removed.
So... if we're standing at a belt, waiting for our bags, and there's a single bag going round and round and round, from a previous flight... should we quietly remove it from the belt, and subtlely place it to the side?... so you can get on with belting our bags??!!!!

I have just been reading this thread and have found it really interesting, thanks Biggles for all your imput. It gives us a greater understanding how you guys work.

I felt sorry for you guys yesterday in the pouring rain!

quote:Originally posted by McCoy
quote:Originally posted by Biggles
Also, when you get to the baggage belt, take a cursory glance at the bags already going around on the belt. Are they from your flight? If not, we're probably outside, waiting to unload, but we can't start until the 'old' bags are removed.
So... if we're standing at a belt, waiting for our bags, and there's a single bag going round and round and round, from a previous flight... should we quietly remove it from the belt, and subtlely place it to the side?... so you can get on with belting our bags??!!!!

Welllllll, in theory, Yes!

But .... just because the belt is empty it doesn't mean that we can start loading it with the next flight. The belt being empty has to be noticed by the BAA baggage people. They're the ones who allocate each belt to a flight (or flights!), start and stop the belts, update the TV monitors with flight/belt info, and so on.

Once it's empty, they let us know to start loading.

More often than not, they will let us start loading bags when there are just a few left from the previous flight.



As an aside, the BAA used to employ people who worked in the baggage hall. They would remove the last few bags from a belt allowing it to be re-used, they would keep the place tidy, they would liaise with the various airlines, help passengers, keep the trolleys tidy, etc.
The BAA decided to do away with them, and then it all started to go wrong!

[honey lamb]

That reply has just reminded me of something. OK, I know it's not in your bailiwick but you may be able to make a comment.

In T1 where the ROI and (I think) NI flights come in there are 2 baggage carousels. The last time I came through we were assigned our carousel and also two other flights were assigned the same carousel. Fair enough, they would be coming in later. What I hadn't realised was that one of the flights comes in only 10 minutes after mine (I found this out as I was booking my niece on it) and in fact, even though we were all standing around and waiting, the bags of the later flight came out first and then without any pause, ours popped up! Any reason why they wouldn't have used the second carousel for one of the flights?

quote:Originally posted by Biggles
Katie (any anyone else ...)

I can't comment on how it happens at Gatwick, but at Heathrow ...

it sometimes happens that we have problems getting the 'Transfer' and 'Upper' baggage bins off the aircraft, and the 'Y' bins are ready to go. They're all being done by different people, so once the guys with the Y are ready they head off to the baggage hall. Meanwhile, we're struggling with the Trans/Upper bins and eventually get them off, and they head off to the baggage hall.

Down at the baggage hall, they know what time the plane landed, so they know what time to expect to see the baggage bins from the flight. And, they expect to see the 'Upper' first. If they don't arrive first, then they make the 'Y' guys wait their turn (and drive around the one-way system again!) until the 'Upper' bins arrive and start unloading.
Just occasionally, somebody from Virgin Baggage will appear, ask about a hold up, and suggest that we start with the 'Y' bags before the 'Upper' bags have arrived. But this is quite rare. We do our utmost to make sure that the 'Upper' bags are delivered first.

Also, when you get to the baggage belt, take a cursory glance at the bags already going around on the belt. Are they from your flight? If not, we're probably outside, waiting to unload, but we can't start until the 'old' bags are removed.



Following on from my previous post about the long wait for PE bags at Manchester, can I just say that when I returned from MCO to Man this Saturday (10th), all our PE cases were with us within 10 minutes of getting into the baggage claim area. A vast improvement and congratulations on the baggage handlers at Manchester airport. We checked in online and did a bag-drop at Downtown Disney.

Katie

Just a quick question is it possible when flying in Y with an au card they just check the bag in a Y rather than changing them to UC?

[honey lamb]

quote:Originally posted by seanpep
Just a quick question is it possible when flying in Y with an au card they just check the bag in a Y rather than changing them to UC?

They shouldn't. An au card should be in the UC bins

Don;t forget that even if flying in Y if you have an AU card you can check in at the UC desks