Panorama - Why Hate Ryanair?

quote:Originally posted by willd
Just seen this little snippet on the BBC website (not sure if works outside the UK)- its MOL at his best!

You cant access iPlayer outside of the UK due to the fact that iPlayer is funded by the UK Licence fee and as a result its deemed unfair that people who have not paid for the service can access content for free. Of course this ignores the fact that if in the UK you do not have to have a licence fee to watch iPlayer. And that currently people in countries such as the Netherlands and Belgium can pick up the Beeb without paying anything.


Don't get me started on the BBC [:0] but what also irritates me is that license fee payers who travel a lot cannot listen to their favourite programmes on iPlayer after the event but the BBC broadcasts them live via the Internet to anyone in the world. Go figure.

[Darren Wheeler]

quote:Originally posted by willd
. Of course this ignores the fact that if in the UK you do not have to have a licence fee to watch iPlayer.


Not strictly true. You don't if using the catch-up option, but you do if watching anything live.

For less than 40p a day for a colour licence is pretty good value in my book. certainly less than the Daily Mail [:)]

What gets up my nose about MO'L is his entire PR machine seems incapable of seeing when they are in the wrong. FR is one of a very select band of advertisers who have to be pre-approved before use and were investigated by the OFT over their lack of compliance and bady worded website.

Expect a free flights offer tomorrow...

Bugger that BBC iPlayer...they are so stupid -- I would PAY to have access to it, but that would mean they needed to be creative and come up with a way to support that.

GJ

[RichardMannion]

I defer to Mr Howard: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq5_joo5l5I - the irony that the BBC uploaded the clip....

quote:Originally posted by Sealink
Expect a free flights offer tomorrow...


Tada!

To celebrate the 11 false claims made by BBC Panorama Ryanair is releasing 1.1million FREE seats at midnight (12th Oct) on http://www.ryanair.com

quote:Originally posted by GrinningJackanapes
Bugger that BBC iPlayer...they are so stupid -- I would PAY to have access to it, but that would mean they needed to be creative and come up with a way to support that.

GJ

Unfortunately it's not just down to non-licence payers seeing content. It's down to the rights acquired for the programming and them not being available outside UK.

Personally I think that has to change - the real value of iplayer is in being able to pick up missed programming and the biggest reason for missing something is that you're out of the country.

FM

P.S. Have a look at the uncut interview with MO'L. Respect?

Was it good then [:D]

So wished I could have seen it. He is not everyones cup of tea but I do love the way he sticks 2 fingers up at system.

68 Million PAX, that is a hell of a lot of disgruntled passengers if we are to believe everything we watch and read.

And was/is his business model so wrong...... a lot of airlines are following his trends?

Iain

The Beeb are an interesting one. There was a real battle at the BBC Trust by some to stop iPlayer from being launched, personally I think it is one of the best services that the BBC offer. I understand Slinky's point about people being out of the country however I beleive it has something to do with who owns the rights to the programmes. A lot of the BBC made content is now available on series link so is online for a hell of a lot longer than a week, which does assist those who are abroad on holiday/business.


Back on topic though. THe programme was interesting, nothing that a frequent flier/aviation enthusiast does not already know. However they were careful not to make the level of remarks that Dispatches did back in 2006.

One point did seem rather relevant to us lot about aviation in general and that was the fact that the new bread of flyer has no brand loyalty. FR works well because those that fly them have no brand loyalty whatsoever and as long as you do not expect the service levels of a full fair airline you will be fine. There was a hint that BA/VS are now realising they have to appeal to those passengers with no brand loyalty, so whilst we will all spend a bit more dosh to fly VS the vast majority of people will not, they will look for the cheapest fair. I guess the school of thought is that why on earth should you pay for 2 bags in Y, if you do not use both of them.

quote:Originally posted by FamilyMan
uncut interview with MO'L. Respect?


A masterclass from M'OL in how to get oddles of free advertising.

To my mind the BBC wrong footed themselves in lazily going for the populist headline and representing the difference between the headline and actual fare as 'hidden charges' as that is way too easy to rebut. They also failed to challenge him on the difference between being well used and being popular.

Paul

quote:Originally posted by Sealink
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
Expect a free flights offer tomorrow...


Tada!

To celebrate the 11 false claims made by BBC Panorama Ryanair is releasing 1.1million FREE seats at midnight (12th Oct) on http://www.ryanair.com


MMMM nearly had a weekend in Dublin for 4p but they want to charge me 20 for using a visa debit card,does anyone still issue visa electron.

quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
Expect a free flights offer tomorrow...


Tada!

To celebrate the 11 false claims made by BBC Panorama Ryanair is releasing 1.1million FREE seats at midnight (12th Oct) on http://www.ryanair.com


MMMM nearly had a weekend in Dublin for 4p but they want to charge me 20 for using a visa debit card,does anyone still issue visa electron.


Well apparently according to my bank manager visa electron is increasing in its use. HSBC are replacing all debit cards with visa electrons for all customers that hold student/young persons accounts or a graduate/postgrad account. Apparently maestro/solo etc will be phased out in the coming years as the rest of the world uses Visa Electron.

[Darren Wheeler]

and as soon as everyone has Electro, FR will then start charging for that...

quote:Originally posted by willd
quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
Expect a free flights offer tomorrow...


Tada!

To celebrate the 11 false claims made by BBC Panorama Ryanair is releasing 1.1million FREE seats at midnight (12th Oct) on http://www.ryanair.com


MMMM nearly had a weekend in Dublin for 4p but they want to charge me 20 for using a visa debit card,does anyone still issue visa electron.


Well apparently according to my bank manager visa electron is increasing in its use. HSBC are replacing all debit cards with visa electrons for all customers that hold student/young persons accounts or a graduate/postgrad account. Apparently maestro/solo etc will be phased out in the coming years as the rest of the world uses Visa Electron.


Ive checked 5 current accounts we hold and they are all visa debit so no Guinness for me[:#]

quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
quote:Originally posted by willd
quote:Originally posted by jaguarpig
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
quote:Originally posted by Sealink
Expect a free flights offer tomorrow...


Tada!

To celebrate the 11 false claims made by BBC Panorama Ryanair is releasing 1.1million FREE seats at midnight (12th Oct) on http://www.ryanair.com


MMMM nearly had a weekend in Dublin for 4p but they want to charge me 20 for using a visa debit card,does anyone still issue visa electron.


Well apparently according to my bank manager visa electron is increasing in its use. HSBC are replacing all debit cards with visa electrons for all customers that hold student/young persons accounts or a graduate/postgrad account. Apparently maestro/solo etc will be phased out in the coming years as the rest of the world uses Visa Electron.


Ive checked 5 current accounts we hold and they are all visa debit so no Guinness for me[:#]


Well I have just looked this up and it appears my bank manager has been getting himself confused. Maestro and Solo will be phased out to be replaced by Visa Debit starting with Student/Grad accounts. Electron cards will only be offered to children's accounts as they are mainly aimed at those without overdraft facilities or for most basic accounts (rather like Solo IIRC).

The best bit about all this though is that the Visa electron card is not even available in Ireland!

If you want a Visa Electron Card get a Halifax Easycash account, any other account gives you just a normal Visa Debit

http://www.halifax.co.uk/bankaccounts/easycash.asp

So may not be ideal, but if you know you're about to buy flights then you can try to beat the system this way

Redacted Copyrighted Material - Decker (From the Contact Us page 'Copyright 2008. All rights reserved.')

[Neil]

quote:Originally posted by Darren Wheeler
and as soon as everyone has Electro, FR will then start charging for that...


Exactly. It doesn't cost them to process visa debit transactions, so the only real justification for the charge can be an 'admin' charge, but surely then it would be the same for an Electron transaction. Just another money making scheme.

I agree with Paul, there is a HUGE difference between being popular and being busy and that wasn't pushed by the BBC. Not a great program IMO, and to be honest, I think it was pretty pointless. MOL, for all his many faults, will never be swayed in to thinking he or the FR model is wrong, so I just don't get the point of the program.

[Decker]

Well the model ISN'T wrong, it's doing exactly what the shareholders want it to do - make money. It's a commercial enterprise subject to market forces. I actually came out of the show quite liking him and RyanAir.

[Neil]

quote:Originally posted by Decker
Well the model ISN'T wrong, it's doing exactly what the shareholders want it to do - make money. It's a commercial enterprise subject to market forces. I actually came out of the show quite liking him and RyanAir.


I'm not saying the model is wrong and quite obviously it has a place in the market and it is working, but was amount of that success is down to people not having any other viable options.

We don't have a LCC model like we did 10 years ago, maybe if people had a real choice, then it would counter MOL's argument that just because they do well, they aren't hated. This was something I thought that the show didn't challenge enough and with them deciding to 'pick' on a very stubborn, outspoken character like MOL, surely they realised it was never going to really achieve anything.

You can sign up for a Virtual Card with http://www.entropay.com. Minimum top up is 10.00, which iirc they charge 1 for. Still better than 20 with FR and you get the number, expiry date and CVV on screen.

AFAIK (and this is in general) Visa Electron is given to customers that are less trustworthy, Visa Debit goes to most customers. The differences between them are small. The main one being that Electron has zero floor limits - that being it always goes online to get authorisation from your bank. Debit may or may not go online. Say you spend 5, there is a chance the floor limit for the merchant may be 20. Assuming the card decides not to go online for a random security/comms check the transaction is authorised without checking the account. In the past you also weren't able to use Electron for mail order etc but with the advent I think that restriction has gone.

Visa Electron/Debit are the property of the Visa Scheme. Solo/Maestro are the equivalents for Mastercard. Normally if your bank changes to use the other it's a business decision.

[honey lamb]

quote:Originally posted by willd

The best bit about all this though is that the Visa electron card is not even available in Ireland!

Tell me about it! What annoys me about Ryanair is that I have no option but to pay by credit card with its attendant costs, whereas with Aer Lingus I can use my debit card for free - well apart from the handling charge that is applied to all transactions regardless of the method of payment. Every so often I feel I should complain to someone like a regulator or Ombudsman but as I fly them so rarely I really don't have the energy to do so.

quote:Originally posted by Sealink
You can sign up for a Virtual Card with http://www.entropay.com. Minimum top up is 10.00, which iirc they charge 1 for. Still better than 20 with FR and you get the number, expiry date and CVV on screen.


Maybe Guinness for JP after all, Junior JP has an Electron card although she doesn't know if she has 4p in her account at the moment [:D]

quote:Originally posted by Neil

We don't have a LCC model like we did 10 years ago, maybe if people had a real choice, then it would counter MOL's argument that just because they do well, they aren't hated. This was something I thought that the show didn't challenge enough and with them deciding to 'pick' on a very stubborn, outspoken character like MOL, surely they realised it was never going to really achieve anything.


I agree with you to an extent Neil. Its true on certain routes FR have a huge monopoly and so therefore charge through the roof for their no frills service. A great example was last year when I went to Poznan in Poland for a wedding, the only viable option (taking into account flight timings, the ending of the BA service and the ridiculous timings of flights from WAW-POZ) was FR and as a result the price was well over 250 per person. However I can understand exactly why they do this, as it is a business, although I do wonder how many people fly FR out of lack of choice rather than as a preference over other carriers.

However there is much more competition on the key popular routes (think of all the new carriers; Wizz, Bmibaby, Jet2, SkyEurope (no longer with us), Germanwings, Vueling etc) and I think the market is still very much competitive. Granted we have seen the introduction of things such as speedy boarding or extra legroom seats but these are all traits of a traditional low cost carrier, charging you for something that would be free on another more traditional carrier.

Yeah off to DUB for 4p in total,thanks BBC[y]