virgin clubhouse now open to all not just u/c?

ok, got 2010 virgin holiday brochure and am either confused or blatently peedoff.

according to the brochure for both LGW & LHR virgin flights they give the normal upgrade costs for premium and upperclass which you opt to add on if you want to upgrade your flight. Fair dues etc.

HOWEVER - I saw this also added : regardless of flight fare you can now opt to upgrade lounges to 1/Vroom 2/ Executive (45) which I think when we first flew and opted for premium (long time ago when it was launched) was run by servis air. BUT NOW THEY HAVE ADDED 60 TO GAIN ACCESS TO CLUBHOUSE AT LHR AND/OR LGW!

Sorry to moan here, but if I am reading this right, CLUBHOUSE was for UPPER CLASS FARE PASSENGERS - to be with the kind of folk that are in the same ball park figure fare wise.

Yet from the jist of this, Virgin have now decided to let all and sundry into the Clubhouse if you are happy to pay 60 and not the Upper Class fare ?

If anyone has the 2010 virgin holidays USA brochure you will see this, and YES I am peed off, I thought the whole point of paying an upper class fare was to get exclusivity of the ClubHouse ????

I will be interested to see if anyone else is suprised/disgusted to see this 60 entrance fee being thrown around, because what this now says to me is : football/stag/hen party louts paying an economy fare and getting upperclass service/perks except for the seat/bar in flight ?

I think quite a few frequent flyers will (as we will if it doesn't get stopped) be jumping ship and flying with British Airways - who clealry understand the ranks of segregation/tiering perks.

Richard Branson, clearly has lost focus on what 'working your way to Gold Status' is all about. To introduce this 'open class' is in my opinion relaunching his whole flying empire under a new heading :
OPEN CLASS.

A very very angry flyer.

It appears 'gone are the days of' reward, loyalty and respect, because when people book and pay for an aupper class ticket, they do not expect to have the perks offered to economy/budget fare payers for a mere 60.

Seriously thinking : I would not pay to fly virgin upper class ever again, I want and expect a difference in service at this level of fare cost, and a service not for sale to Tom Dick & Harriet for 60. At least BA do not budge on their policy : want it pay for it !!!

Virgin Holidays have always offered their customers entrance to either the LHR or LGW for a fee. Nothing new here.

This has been the case for some time IIRC, VH have been offering this however it they limit the number they sell per day/flight so that the CH isn't over run with Y/PE. As this as you mentioned would take away from UC pax that have paid a heap more.

Dominic

quote:Originally posted by DMetters-Bone
they limit the number they sell per day/flight so that the CH isn't over run with Y/PE. As this as you mentioned would take away from UC pax that have paid a heap more.

Dominic


I wish that was the case Dominic - more than once at LGW my stay at the CH has been less than attractive due to rowdy groups being there - if it has a limit on numbers it must be a very large limit indeed ! One can but hope that the increase in charge to 60 per pax may put some of these parties off [:w]

I had hoped this would have stopped once the V-Room had opened but it seems not [}:)]

HG

[Scrooge]

Gentlemen, please remember the little rule about no personal attacks please, if you have something to say please do it in private.

I will leave the thread open for now, but please remember that all posts are subject to editing by a mod if it is deemed necessary.

Just for info VH online is still saying 35 for the LGW clubhouse.

I have just booked a V Holiday for December 2010, and was offered Clubhouse access for 35 at Gatwick, its 60 for Heathrow

I am not having a go at anyone, I am just voicing my opinion, and that opinion is (though maybe old fashioned) that : why is it viewed as a 'right' to have access to everything without paying the 'full/fair fare' ?

As for 'having a pop at the people at the back of the plane' : I didn't & I started off flying (like the majority) in those very seats too, and there is nothing wrong with them or the people sitting on them, at the end of the day we have choices. My point is that - we have choices - and when people pay for upper class they expect to get upper class, they do not expect to see the perks of it handed to those not willing to pay the upper class fare.

Re brats : for example - I am not happy seeing (anywhere for that matter) kids putting dirty shoes on chairs that others will sit on after they have departed, I have yet to meet a parent who allows their kids to come if from running in a park and walk over their furniture in their shoes - yet once outside the family home, some parents are happy to let their kids do just that, with no consideration to the fact someone else will choose to sit there after.

I guess I am too old fashioned,and still believe children should be seen and not heard and parents should control their kids and teach them what is/isn't acceptable behaviour and stop making the rest of us endure it.

As for: offers made by virgin holidays ? Maybe someone eg Northernhenry could explain why Upperclass etc is referred to by S.Ridgway as a haven for BUSINESS TRAVELLERS, and, Antoinette Nassopoulos, Partner, Foster + Partners also refers to the clubhouse as a place for : business travellers. I fail to see how Business Travellers and Holidaymakers are of the same. Therefore I still think the old saying : never mix business with pleasure is a valid one - because it has just been mentioned above : Rowdy people are gaining access to Club Houses -the very icon referred to by virgin as - 'a private members club'

I still think - you should get what you pay for, and if something is portrayed as something elite, then it should stay in that bracket, to encourage people to aspire to something better, something special. When things are too esily accessible they loose their value, they tend to fall into the 'easy come, easy go' catagory. So I will repeat my feelings on this : I have no issue with anyone experiencing anything, providing the people experiencing it are paying the same amount as everyone else who IS paying the full price. And re brats : good behaviour is ageless - though society benefits when everyone is accountable for their own behaviour and the behaviour of those they mentor.

I had no idea virgin holidays had been offering holiday makers access to a business (eg clubhouse) lounge, had I known that I would have considered jumping ship to BA sooner than next year. I think VA have had enough of my 's, I am too long in the tooth to change my views on 'what I deem as acceptable' so as they say : Wake Up Smell the Coffee - and yes, my eyes have been fully opened, I thought when I flew Upper Class I was special, and that I had bought into something that was set up soley for Upper Class fare payers. How wrong was I, all my dreams have been shattered, I feel I have misguided my own children in portraying : if you want something you must work hard, strive harder, aspire more, keep pushing so you too can have the lifestyle of the very best, that exclusivity, that extra something. Yet in the words of my own son - 'life isn't like that anymore, peoples' values have changed, it's all about the 'now', what's in it for me?'

So very sad, why can't things of exclusivity stay just that ?

[Neil]

Who says everyone travelling UC is a business traveller? We fly UC an only fly for leisure. I think you have very outdated opinions on how people travel nowadays. The fact that VH and VS have been offering paid access to the CH for numerous years and you haven't noticed and it hasn't impacted on your experiences then it shows that your angry reasonings are misplaced

quote:Originally posted by Neil
Who says everyone travelling UC is a business traveller? We fly UC an only fly for leisure.

In the very same way that many that fly in BA Club or First are leisure travellers too - flying up front is a lot more afordable to do on a regualr basis now a days that it was when I was young(er) !

HG

[mitchja]

Sorry but if you don't like it, simple, fly a different airline then.

Regards

[RichardMannion]

Exclusivity? Mmm, that'd be pushing it.

Clubhouses have been open to paid access for various groups for a very long time, these include:

Virgin Holidays - the numbers are limited, and if it wasn't for this revenue stream then the LGW CH would more than likely not exist. What airline in their right mind is going to turn away that lucrative profit stream, esp. in this climate?

AmEx - for a long time, Platinum Chargecard customers had access regardless of class of travel. Centurion customers had access for a very long time too, and now have access via FC Au. Again, it's a very lucrative revenue stream. Numbers were in theory capped.

FlyingCo - points can be changed for Clubhouse access vouchers.

So there are plenty of people that can have access to the CH without them actually flying in Upper. Just like a FC Au can get access for them and guest (and Au status is not that hard to obtain, and again is used as a lucrative revenue stream in some instances). I've seen a group of celebs in a CH before when they weren't even flying VS - but I'm not losing any sleep over it.

To think that CH's are just for business customers is clearly deluded - they cater for business customers with some aspects, but they are not exclusively for them. Steve Ridgway's comment has been taken out of context. There is a growing market of customers traveling in Premium cabins that are not on business (I fall into this category as very little of my travel is work related nowadays). To say that the rowdy people are getting access is misguided, as I think many have a story about a group of misbehaving business people on a plane or indeed in a lounge.

All in, Clubhouses are still exclusive. If you don't want to pay (in one form or another) then you don't get access. Even if they were to take payment on the door (which I have seen at other lounges), then I still wouldn't lose sleep over it and I wouldn't think it was any less exclusive - unless it was of detriment to the service levels and capacity of facility. Given the capacity controls in place via some of the arrangements such as VHols, then I'm not worried about this being an issue.

[honey lamb]

While I can understand your feelings about wanting to keep the exclusivity of the Clubhouse, I must refute a couple of your points.

You have constantly stated that the Clubhouse is for Upper Class passengers and should remain so. I and several V-Flyers have used the Clubhouse while travelling in other classes. No, we haven't paid 60 entrance fee but we are entitled to do so as VS Gold members regardless of class of travel. Therefore we are not, to quote yourself
quote: the kind of folk that are in the same ball park figure fare wise.

You state:
quote: Maybe someone eg Northernhenry could explain why Upperclass etc is referred to by S.Ridgway as a haven for BUSINESS TRAVELLERS, and, Antoinette Nassopoulos, Partner, Foster + Partners also refers to the clubhouse as a place for : business travellers. I fail to see how Business Travellers and Holidaymakers are of the same. Therefore I still think the old saying : never mix business with pleasure is a valid one - because it has just been mentioned above : Rowdy people are gaining access to Club Houses -the very icon referred to by virgin as - 'a private members club'
While Upper Class is marketed as a place for business travellers, ( and it should be pointed out all airlines market their premium cabins thus) there is nothing to stop leisure travellers from using that cabin. My travel is exclusively leisure travel and for the most part it is taken in Upper Class. I resent the suggestion that because I am a leisure traveller I should not be allowed in and the inference that leisure travellers are ipso facto rowdy.

Paid access to the Clubhouse is, I understand, subject to capacity on the day. It has been suggested on one post on this thread that allowing paid access is allowing a rowdy element in. May I suggest that it is entirely possible that some of the rowdy passengers in the Clubhouses may well also be paying Upper Class passengers. Such behaviour isn't limited to the 'lower' cabins [:w]

Hmmm. What about Gold Cards flying economy and Miles upgrades to Upper? They haven't 'paid' for their access (for that flight anyway). And what about guests who are not flying upper? add elite card holders of partners airlines.....? Should we exclude Z fares? They've not paid as much as J and D.


Edit. Just noticed RM and HL saying the same things..I should type quicker.

'"I have no issue with anyone experiencing anything

quote:Originally posted by honey lamb
It has been suggested on one post on this thread that allowing paid access is allowing a rowdy element in.

Woops that was me [:I]

To put my comment in perspective (as I feel it may have been lost above) I was referring to a large stag party en route to Vegas who had paid entrance to LGW CH (35 ?). Sorry to say but their 'behavour' did spoil it for us - their main effort was to drink their entrance fee and abuse as many other PAX as they could in their endeavours; try exlaining that to a couple of toddlers [:w]

Sorry if I offend with my comments.

HG

[RichardMannion]

quote:Originally posted by hackneyguy
their main effort was to drink their entrance fee


Well 1 out of 2 is understandable for socials.... [:w]

quote:Originally posted by RichardMannion
quote:Originally posted by hackneyguy
their main effort was to drink their entrance fee


Well 1 out of 2 is understandable for socials.... [:w]


Excatly - time and place and all that ...... [:X]

Good grief gs, have you been living in a sterile bubble all these years!

Sorry your dream is shattered, welcome to the real world [:#].

quote:Originally posted by slinky09
Good grief gs, have you been living in a sterile bubble all these years!

Sorry your dream is shattered, welcome to the real world [:#].


Obviously not flying in Business Class (either BA Club or VA Upper Class) or First else he would have noticed that this is now things are in 21st Century.

Maybe, just maybe, the Concorde room may afford a certain amount exlusivity, however it is not what it once was when the Bird was flying [:w]

This is what the VS website says about the LHR Lounge-

'Our flagship Clubhouse at Heathrow airport is full of stylish features and interiors, with service designed to feel like a private members club. Whatever your mood, we think it's the ultimate preflight experience.'

I think that sums it up.

It does not specifically refer to 'business' people and recognises,as others have said, that pax travelling these days in the 'business' seats are not always travelling on business but an increasing part of the leisure market.

Its the same with other airlines. They long ago ditched the names 'business lounge' and 'business class cabin' because it does not reflect the nature of the people travelling now.

quote:Originally posted by gravitating south
ok, got 2010 virgin holiday brochure and am either confused or blatently peedoff.

according to the brochure for both LGW & LHR virgin flights they give the normal upgrade costs for premium and upperclass which you opt to add on if you want to upgrade your flight. Fair dues etc.

HOWEVER - I saw this also added : regardless of flight fare you can now opt to upgrade lounges to 1/Vroom 2/ Executive (45) which I think when we first flew and opted for premium (long time ago when it was launched) was run by servis air. BUT NOW THEY HAVE ADDED 60 TO GAIN ACCESS TO CLUBHOUSE AT LHR AND/OR LGW!

Sorry to moan here, but if I am reading this right, CLUBHOUSE was for UPPER CLASS FARE PASSENGERS - to be with the kind of folk that are in the same ball park figure fare wise.

Yet from the jist of this, Virgin have now decided to let all and sundry into the Clubhouse if you are happy to pay 60 and not the Upper Class fare ?

If anyone has the 2010 virgin holidays USA brochure you will see this, and YES I am peed off, I thought the whole point of paying an upper class fare was to get exclusivity of the ClubHouse ????

I will be interested to see if anyone else is suprised/disgusted to see this 60 entrance fee being thrown around, because what this now says to me is : football/stag/hen party louts paying an economy fare and getting upperclass service/perks except for the seat/bar in flight ?

I think quite a few frequent flyers will (as we will if it doesn't get stopped) be jumping ship and flying with British Airways - who clealry understand the ranks of segregation/tiering perks.

Richard Branson, clearly has lost focus on what 'working your way to Gold Status' is all about. To introduce this 'open class' is in my opinion relaunching his whole flying empire under a new heading :
OPEN CLASS.

A very very angry flyer.

It appears 'gone are the days of' reward, loyalty and respect, because when people book and pay for an aupper class ticket, they do not expect to have the perks offered to economy/budget fare payers for a mere 60.

Seriously thinking : I would not pay to fly virgin upper class ever again, I want and expect a difference in service at this level of fare cost, and a service not for sale to Tom Dick & Harriet for 60. At least BA do not budge on their policy : want it pay for it !!!





Managed to delete my post (will re-post it when I get back to my room)

Similarly deleted mine..

my comments reflected VS passengers using an offer presented to them by VS/VH
[|:)]

nh

quote:Obviously not flying in Business Class (either BA Club or VA Upper Class) or First else he would have noticed that this is now things are in 21st Century.

PS: Ian, OP is female [B)]

quote:Originally posted by northernhenry

quote:Obviously not flying in Business Class (either BA Club or VA Upper Class) or First else he would have noticed that this is now things are in 21st Century.

PS: Ian, OP is female [B)]


Woops was following Scrooge's lead by him saying 'Gentlemen'. [:I]

My mistake for not checking facts - apologies to the OP

HG

OK -back in the room now (a very nice one in the Intercontinental in Madrid as it happens).gravitating south, I take exception to the bulk of your two posts. I am a holiday maker (your terminlogy) - otherwise known as a leisure traveller (much nicer term I think).I am about to take my third UC trip since March - does the fact that I'm not a business traveller make me any less worthy???
An UC ticket (regardless if it's a cash or miles fare) gets you a nice comfy seat somewhere near the front of the plane. End of. CH access has been available through numerous routes (as alluded to by many posters) for years.
I have a brat (Dragonbaby) as do many others here.Granted she's slightly older now but I can assure you she's never climbed on seats (and has spent a reasonable proportion of her flying career like many other 'brattish' offspring here sitting in the comfy seats).The worst behaviour I've seen in the CH (and on board for that matter) has been with zelebs and fare paying passengers .Incidentally VH paid CH access is only available for the over 12s.
Finally I find the use of the word 'segregation' unpleasant. Perhaps you'd like to reconsider your terminology.
Hope you're a strong swimmer (as you're about to jump ship).
Harriet (oops should read DragonLady).