Are the Virgin Atlantic Facebook pages good for the airline?

[Nottingham Nick]

I know we have talked about the Facebook pages quite a lot in the past, but I was reading them tonight and just saw post after post slating the airline. Some of them are by the same people doing multiple posts, but the overwhelming impression from the pages is a negative one.

They now have nearly 62.000 fans, but a lot people who post seem to use it as a moaning board and some even actively discourage readers from using the airline.

Most of the complaints seem to revolve around poor or non-existent responses from Customer Services, but there are complaints about poor food and dirty planes as well.

There is already a thread from someone who regrets booking on VS because of the the things she has read on the pages, and there must be many, many others who are steered away because of the overwhelmingly negative vibes.

Virgin seem to be putting a lot of money and staff into the pages, with a big competition and the queries are generally responded to quickly during office hours by Greg and the team, who must be wondering what they have let themselves in for. B)

Is the negative publicity harmful, or are they seen as cutting edge and attractive because they are using the new medium to their advantage?

Nick

I have seen the comments and agree they are very negative, but as with any company, they have opened themselves up for feedback and have to deal with any impact from that.

As they say, people are far more likely to tell people about a bad experience rather than a good experience.

I would actually say it's gotten to the point now, where it is almost obvious that Greg copy and pastes the same response to everyone!

The same issues arise:

- Refunds from volcanic and snow disruption.
- Bad IFE.
- General complaint responses taking over 28 days.

I almost prefer the VH approach, where they PM users and deal with their issues offline - however, with only a 10th of the fan base of VS, clearly easier to manage.

FB is an easy place to provide feedback, VS need to be ready for this and the potential impact (new VS users reading previous comments) on decision to use them.

Personally - I like the FB page and do have a giggle sometimes!

Luke

I think you have made a good point about how much money they are spending on it, I think there are about 3 of them and then a manager or 2 as well. They seem to be dedicated to Facebook/Twitter so, to me, it seems a huge amount to be spending when they haven't been doing great.

But! I think it looks good for the airline, even if the majority of posts are negative, there is generally a quick reply. This makes people happy, well some people. If you look at BA's Facebook page, it looks pointless in comparison. (When I last looked anyway)

Hopefully the people with powers at Virgin pay attention to the feedback given on their page, so they can improve the service and product they offer.

So I think it's a good thing, but they could of found a cheaper way of doing it.

If you look at BA's Facebook page, it looks pointless in comparison. (When I last looked anyway)

at this moment there is not a single post on the BA Facebook 'wall'

at least VS post flight information during the snow/volcano etc.. and some other posts from time to time

If you look at BA's Facebook page, it looks pointless in comparison. (When I last looked anyway)

at this moment there is not a single post on the BA Facebook 'wall'

at least VS post flight information during the snow/volcano etc.. and some other posts from time to time

You've made a really good point, during the whole "snow" issue in December, VS were excellent with their communication. I seem to remember people flying with other airlines actually commenting on VS FB site to state how little info their own airlines were giving them!

[Darren Wheeler]

FB is a real double-edged sword in customer relations terms.

Sometimes I wonder if the rants are more of some personal vendetta against VS, like the virginaircrewlies website. Reading some of the rants I find myself wondering if they have actually got the right airline.

It doesn't help that you only ever get one side of the story.

[buns]

It is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" dilemma for VS

IMHO it was a brave decision for VS to invest in Facebook and Twitter as they have done as handling customer feedback through emerging technologies will always be risky, but I suppose the decision was to embrace it before it takes over y)

Notwithstanding the potential for those who want press their own personal agenda, I think this is proving a good barometer of customer feelings - and fast time at that. We have all seen how Facebook and Twitter have ben used in recent events in the Middle East and I personally think VS are doing the right thing

buns

In general I think the public realise that some forums are places where people need to express themselves and some places are where you can get information and help. I guess it is every v-flyer contributor's duty to try maintain this site as an unconfrontational, accepting place to rationally accept criticism and also help anyone get information or solve their problems. I have found since joining it that this site greatly benefits from the helpful contributions most people make, especially the moderators, who really make the site what it is without being die hard fanatics who won't accept criticism. Long may it last! : )

I personally loathe this Looking for Linda pi*h I see every time on the VS FB page.
IMHO LH have the best FB page.

As others have said though if you open yourself up for feedback get ready for the bad stuff as well.

[Neil]

I like the fact that VS have embraced Facebook. During the two main problem periods in the last 12 months, the Ash Cloud and the December snow chaos, they were excellent at providing up to date and accurate information for pax.

I think the team do in the main a good job, after a shaky start, but they are helpful and concentrate their time on pax with genuine questions and issues.

Of course there is the other side, and it would be stupid for them to think they wouldn't get the negative posts. I think it is clear when reading whether the posts are genuine or just people having a rant, trying to be disruptive. There are many forums, including ours, where people will slag VS off, as least through Facebook they have a platform to be able to respond and be helpful.

We know from posts on here, how some people can class an experience as negative, yet the reasoning behind it is extremely flawed.

I don't think a few negative posts, posted without facts or reasoning are harmful. A post like "the crew were rubbish" is firstly subjective and secondly, without any other reason given for it, becomes just a throw away comment, that most people would ignore. Of course, you will get those who go OTT and get all dramatic (The Dibb anyone??!!) reading a negative comment, but that can't be avoided.

Overall, a big y) from me for the VS Facebook pages and team.

Agree with Neil - I think it's great that VS has embraced social networking, and whether or not we like 'Looking for Linda' or loathe the idiots who just rant, it is a very direct and instant way for service provider and customer to connect. I think they're trailblazing here and it sits squarely in the brand ethos I expect of VS.

[Darren Wheeler]

A quick look around FB at other airlines.

BA. There but no commenting allowed.

Easyjet. There and you can comment against their posts, but not able to post on wall. Comments full of complaints.

Ryanair. There, but Ryanair Complaints and Ryanair ripoff (neither official) appear higher in the list. Can post on 'Just Others' but full of spam, non-english posts and complaints. Their tag line is "Ryanair is an airline with a great sense of humour! If you have none it is your own problem, not ours ". No obvious official responses to complaints.

Air France. There but only official wall. Comments can be posted.

Lufthansa. Very good site with lots of detail and appears to translate for languages. They have a discussion forum, full of complaints. As far as I can tell, no official relies.

United. Has 'just others' wall. Mix of compliments and complaints. No obvious official replies either.

As you can see, it's a bit of a mix bag and on my quick and unscientific trawl, only Virgin seem to give official replies. Of the complaints, poor service, prices and lost baggage seem to be the main areas. Sound familiar?

To answer Nick's question, I not sure that it is good for the airline but then I am not too sure how it could be other than by VS seeming to be "with it!"

So I agree with Neil. y) VS have done exactly the right thing by "embracing" Facebook, it or similar are the future so better to get with the concept.

And re

I like the fact that VS have embraced Facebook. During the two main problem periods in the last 12 months, the Ash Cloud and the December snow chaos, they were excellent at providing up to date and accurate information for pax.

Slightly off topic but along the same theme, we flew last spring a couple of days after all those BA planes headed for the UK, thereby ending the ash cloud related flight restrictions (well done Willie oo)). I used the FlyVirgin - VJAM Flying Club app to update my Facebook page. My VH rep kept in touch with my page to see what was going on, interestingly getting more information from that than any other source. y)

On the whole, FB officially recognised and managed by VS has to be a positive - that coming from someone who doesn't use FB.

I'd urge caution though - they need to give equal attention to other forms of customer service/response, at least for now.

It seems a pity that VS could not have a tab that is just for Complaints. State that any complaint posted elsewhere will be deleted and not answered.
That would get the complaints off the main Wall but still allow them to show that VS are dealing with them.
It would allow the rest of us to filter.

Perhaps those of us who have had positive experiences with VS should make more effort to drop a little bit of positivity on the FB page??

Ambassadors and all.... LOL

Luke

[Darren Wheeler]

A few off here have been there, done that...

The problem is, you just get lost in a sea of multiple posts and some who insist on posting the same thing in every comment.

I do like Bill's idea though.

It seems a pity that VS could not have a tab that is just for Complaints. State that any complaint posted elsewhere will be deleted and not answered.
That would get the complaints off the main Wall but still allow them to show that VS are dealing with them.
It would allow the rest of us to filter.

good idea. y)

I have seen the comments and agree they are very negative, but as with any company, they have opened themselves up for feedback and have to deal with any impact from that.

As they say, people are far more likely to tell people about a bad experience rather than a good experience.

Correct. If they moderated every bad comment they would be accused of censoring their critics.

[Nottingham Nick]

Some great posts, thanks to everyone.
My view, having reflected on it, is that I think it is a good idea that could be executed better.
Greg and the team do a great job, but with limited ability to solve problems - they have to churn out the boiler plate apologies - I am sure Greg's most used word is 'sorry'!

I like Bill's idea of having a separate section for complaints. and I think there lies the rub - the limited ability to adapt the facebook layout hampers customisation of the pages to suit the needs of the user company.

I hope VS persevere with the experiment as I think more and more people will use the net to research their travel plans, but will hopefully not take all posts on the FB site as gospel. I have become a lot more suspicious of really bad or reality gushing reviews on Tripadvisor, and I suppose we will all learn to be selective on what we take as true / unbiased.

Nick

[Scrooge]

I have to agree with Nick, however, IMHO, Greg has been stuck with a worthless job, the company as a whole responds badly to complaints, so people complain on the FB page about it.

People ask questions, Greg talks to others in the company and they give him the wrong answer.

A while back I did spend some time on the correcting the information he gave out, but I have pretty much given in with it, I don't have the time or energy to either correct the info or point out the spin VS is putting on things is pure BS.

Correct. If they moderated every bad comment they would be accused of censoring their critics.

But they would be within their rights to remove duplicate posts. It is the VS page after all.

I like Bill's idea of having a separate section for complaints. and I think there lies the rub - the limited ability to adapt the facebook layout hampers cusotmisation of the pages to suit the needs of the user company.

Even if there were it would not stop people posting their complaints where they like. Nor would it stop people posting the same complaint on numerous other airline related threads (do VS monitor those too?)

People ask questions, Greg talks to others in the company and they give him the wrong answer.

But the whope issue of Greg giving wrong information is down to VS itself. There have been numerous instances listed here about CS staff giving incorrect info. Even the VS website is full of duff and contradictory information.

[Darren Wheeler]

Looks like some changes have been made today.

There use to be 3 view options.

Virgin Atlantic only
Virgin Atlantic and everyone else
Everyone else.

All you have now is.

Virgin Atlantic
Everyone. (which included all the VS items too)

It also seems that some items have been deleted. There was one complaining about 50 staff going off for the Mt Kenya charity event rather than processing their refund.. ii)

I echo the comments that VS embrace of social media has been fantastic during the various snow/ash cloud issues of last year. I certainly found it most helpful when I was caught up in the snow.

The use of Facebook seems to be the current 'trend' in the media world. I am actually quite surprised by just how many companies now have their website address as facebook.com/company name. It seems to be ever increasing.

I however think there is to be a lot more depth in Twitter than facebook. The issues raised here seem to be that the Facebook page isbeing flooded by people making complaints and the wrong information given out. Of course, with a limit of only 140 characters, complaints to the VS Twitter page should be less, especially those rambling complaints. The beauty of twitter is that it enables the carrier to give out a concise message quickly and easily. One of the reasons I cannot be bothered with the VS facebook page is partly because my use of the site has plummeted of late (something that is very much a trend amongst my friends and I who were amongst the first 'invited' users of Facebook when it was only open to about 10 UK universities) and because I can access any VS Twitter info by just following VS and accessing one website page, it is much quicker and easier.

With each major development this year whether it be a natural disaster like the ChCh earthquake, the FCO organising Brits getting out of Libya or a LGW being closed due to a bit of snow, twitter seems to provide much more up to date info which as I say is quick, concise and I dont have to trawl through all the "comments" that one gets on Facebook.

Hi Folks

Many thanks from me also for this useful thread. As a bit of inside info for you, the team behind our social media efforts reports into myself (acting Head of eBusiness) and also into Caroline, our Head of Customer Relations. We call them our Social Relations team and they are just 3 guys who have been in place since about Sept 2010. The manager is Kyle, a recent recruit and who is doing a great job, and the team are Greg and Howard who have been recruited from our Contact Centre/Customer Relations team and who are also well regarded. Greg was seconded into a fore-runner of the role early in 2010 when we were still experimenting with social and he has built up a loyal following of people who ask after him. F.y.i he is currently up Mount Kenya as one of the VAA team raising money for charity.

The remit of the team is simple - S/S/S - servicing, sociability and soft-selling. Servicing as in customer service and this is approx 70% of their role at the moment. Sociability regarding helping to get the VAA brand ethos and personality across (hence the competitions). Soft-selling regarding promoting our products and services and helping to drive some traffic back to our main website. Social isn’t an overt selling tool and never will be so the idea is to at least cover the costs of the team. Servicing is and will remain the top priority and the guys are helping to answer many customer queries at source. The more complex queries will always need to be taken off line but by helping people with simper queries online we can help speed up response to the email and letter flow. The Facebook/Twitter responses will add to our capabilities and I assure you other forms of customer service/responses won’t be neglected.

As some of you spotted, the team were flat out over the three December snow disruptions (LGW, LHR, East Cost US) e.g. we went 24*7 for 3 days for the LHR closure. Not bad for 3 guys working 8 hour shifts. At peak, the guys were answering a tweet every 30 seconds. Yes, many were repeated responses but people generally only look at their own Twitter/FB feeds so putting up a generic reply wouldn’t have helped so we aimed to answer every question. We couldn’t magic the snow away (or encourage the BAA to get their act together to de-ice the runways) but we could provide some hope for stranded pax that at least someone was listening and trying to help. There is a good comparative report here by an independent agency which we are quite proud of as it showed we held our own against the big guys up the road:

http://www.digitaltomorrowtoday.com/201 ... mber-2010/

We are training up some volunteer Contact Relations folks to help out online in case we get such massive disruption again. In the interim, you may also see the odd post from staff we bring in to help eg the team is down to two at the moment as Greg is up a mountain.

Ref a complaints tab, good idea and we’ll consider this. My gut feel is some people will still continue to post complaints anywhere and everywhere. E.g. when we launched the TV ad on Facebook and asked for feedback on it we still had the odd person complaining about baggage allowances !

The comments on this thread are spot on ref social media being a good barometer of customer feelings, and you are likely to see more market research type posts from us on products and services to gauge people’s reactions.

Final point, yes please, continue as some of you are doing already to support Kyle, Greg and Howard in your own positive postings. They are very grateful when experts like you step in to say well done or to answer other customers’ questions.

Fergus (VAA eBiz)