Economy Reward Seat Sale 2 for 1

Perhaps they are trying to get people to offload FC miles on the Econ cabin rather than saving for the front of the plane?

As others have noted, relatively small saving due to the taxes and surcharges on Econ redemption seats - but massive amounts to be saved on a UC fare - for only 80k in some instances.

My wife and I have paid for Econ and PE in the past, (albeit in the lowest buckets), but could never justify even a 'cheap' UC fare, (maybe the £1006 over Christmas...). But we can go UC with miles.

Has anyone noticed relatively empty Y cabins recently?

They were last year on the occasions we flew but PE and UC were full. If a seat is empty it probably doesn't cost too much to switch it to a reward seat??

I shan't be taking up the offer; we'll keep saving for those seats at the front!!

I was having a bit of a play around earlier (quiet day for me with the US closed...), and could get a net save of about £600 for 2 BGI flights next jan (I.e. About £300 per ticket difference between revenue and reward) - which would be 47.5k miles. Just about on the cusp of acceptable, although there's also the miles lost from not what you'd earn on a revenue flight plus my AU top up.

Anyone do better than that?

Am I understanding this correctly? Taxes and surcharges are payable on both tickets? This seems like a very mis-leading offer!

It's only £20 more per ticket for a normal ticket.

Sadly taxes and surcharges apply to each and every ticket whether its full fare, sale fare, reward fare etc.

Not sure how you are coming up with only £20 difference?

I did a dummy run LHR to JFK 15th May x 5days.

The reward fare would cost £305.16 taxes etc + 29,500 miles.

Assuming there is availablity for 2 persons then that would be £610.32 + 29,500miles.

The current cheapest economy fare is £505.26 (inclusive of taxes etc), and for two persons = £1010.52 and that is taking very favourable flight times both out & in bound.

So that appears to be a saving with the 2 for 1 reward offer of £400.

Of course once you waste about an hour hanging on trying to speak to the FC, then you'll probably be told of all sorts of restrictions on the 2 for 1 offer and that's why you have to phone to book rather than booking on-line ii) !

Certainly a shame the offer cannot be used with AmEx vouchers as mine are going to waste soon.

Ditto dummy booking results;

JFK return in June: Out Sat, back Wed.

£305.16 each!!! (plus the Credit Card fee!!!!)

I've seen fares for sub £400 fairly regularly.

This particular brand of misleading is getting wearing...

Am I understanding this correctly? Taxes and surcharges are payable on both tickets? This seems like a very mis-leading offer!

It's only £20 more per ticket for a normal ticket.

Not sure on that figure...but even so... For VS a quick fix for some revenue, (oops sorry, "unexpected sudden change in the fuel market, nessessitating a surcharge for unexpected costs..") :w and off loading peoples miles accounts for a few quid saving....

Welcome to the world of the VS Marketing Department, an ability to handle spinning a distinct advantage ):

Is it bad that I saw the title of the email came in, and automatically assumed it would just be economy. Serious waste of time for the majority of FF's who collect miles. There cant be many people out there who will go "Yes! What a great offer!". Waste of perfectly good email marketing spend if you ask me.

This offer is also anti single person. Not everyone has a +1 to travel with so BOGOFs are worthless. Why not a simple 50% off offer?

*elitism alert on*

Mind the chances of me ever flying economy again are zero !

*alert off*

This offer is also anti single person. Not everyone has a +1 to travel with so BOGOFs are worthless. Why not a simple 50% off offer?

*elitism alert on*

Mind the chances of me ever flying economy again are zero !

*alert off*

I agree Tonty, it's an offer that is effectively pointless for a single traveller - and by virtue of that, is excluding a large number of potential travellers.

I hasten to add however that, much like yourself, I made the decision years ago never to fly economy again, so it's a rather moot point

Never thought that i'd use miles for an economy flight because of the limited savings... but recently did that for a one way flight to the US (joining a cruise back to Europe!) - as that is actually a decent saving over the one way prices (which aren't cheap - £750ish to NYC!) at just a shade over £200 + 14,750 miles.. is the only time i'd do that, same if not staying a saturday night they can be quite a saving as the lower fare codes require a saturday night stay! Gotta agree that it's not really worth it over a standard return economy cash purchase though!

(It's since been upgraded to PE and if/when availability opens up a bit further forwards on the plane is the plan!)

I haven't received an email about this, so would anyone be kind enough to copy the content on here so those who didn't receive it can take a look especially regarding it possibly being misleading?

I haven't received an email about this, so would anyone be kind enough to copy the content on here so those who didn't receive it can take a look especially regarding it possibly being misleading?

I just did, but then realised I'd broken forum rules - hence my hasty delete of it What's your email? I'll send you a copy

Before the email came out, my parents rang up the FC to ask if they can buy Y tickets and upgrade them to PE. Now my parents are your typical FC members where they fly to the US once every 2-3 years but had accrued enough miles for the upgrades.

FC told them a price which after the taxes and surcharges was only £150 each more than a revenue PE ticket.

So my Dad asked what's the point with the miles if you can't use them without incurring fees. The agent said that there isn't and he uses his miles to buy wine from Virgin Wines instead.

So my parents have now brought a revenue Y ticket, saving the miles and blowing them on the one and only time they'll fly UC.

You have to love the fact that a VS agent would only recommend using miles for wine vouchers...

And if it weren't for the fact that I have the Wine Society more or less on my doorstep, it might have been an option for me to look at as well!

I haven't received an email about this, so would anyone be kind enough to copy the content on here so those who didn't receive it can take a look especially regarding it possibly being misleading?

http://www.virgin-atlantic.com/en/gb/fr ... rmiles.jsp

How is it misleading? It says two for one reward flights. Doesn't at any point say "free". And at the foot of the page above clearly states the t&c around fares and taxes.

Whether it is good value, and the level of taxation, are surely different issues ?|

I haven't received an email about this, so would anyone be kind enough to copy the content on here so those who didn't receive it can take a look especially regarding it possibly being misleading?

http://www.virgin-atlantic.com/en/gb/fr ... rmiles.jsp

How is it misleading? It says two for one reward flights. Doesn't at any point say "free". And at the foot of the page above clearly states the t&c around fares and taxes.

Whether it is good value, and the level of taxation, are surely different issues ?|

The headline banner says 'you'll get two seats for the price of one' - irrespective of the small print, it's misleading.

The headline banner says 'you'll get two seats for the price of one' - irrespective of the small print, it's misleading.

Perhaps I received a different email - I don't see the word "price" in any email or webpage.

That said, you do have to understand the nature of Rewards to get the full picture.

I think the second paragraph is misleading, it's says that if you book a reward seat before 5th March, you will get 2 seats.

This implies, in my eyes, that you book one seat, pay the miles and taxes and surcharges, then you will get a second seat.

Yes the more experienced and cynical of us will assume that the taxes and fees etc will be charged to the second seat as well. But for the people who don't have the same amount of reward booking knowledge, it's misleading.

Interestingly, the code of the Advertising Standards Authority as it relates to pricing has this to say:

Price statements must not mislead by omission, undue emphasis or distortion.

And

Quoted prices must include non-optional taxes, duties, fees and charges that apply to all or most buyers.

Now if I saw a VS ad. or email saying 2-for-1 price, and actually I don't recall receiving this email so I don't know if it said price in any form, I would think that it meant non-optional taxes, duties, fees and charges would be included.

So, if the email did say 'price', as SWWinters744 says, then I could believe that it is misleading and VS are potentially in trouble. If not, then not.

Either way, it sets an expectation - if you're used to paying 29,500 miles plus taxes and VS fees and saw a 2-for-1 offer, I'd assume first that genuinely was 2-for-1 but would always check the print. Then I would arch my eyebrow and say, "oh really, typical advertising"!

The headline banner says 'you'll get two seats for the price of one' - irrespective of the small print, it's misleading.

Perhaps I received a different email - I don't see the word "price" in any email or webpage.

That said, you do have to understand the nature of Rewards to get the full picture.

Upon reading the email again, I admit the word 'price' doesn't appear in the email - so I apologize for that.

However, it does say 'you'll get two seats instead of one' - which, by implication, is a BOGOF to the vast majority of people.

Perhaps VS have not been purposely misleading, but are being so by selective wording and omission of detail.

Hi Everyone,
I only noticed this offer as my girlfriend got the email. For some reason and even after several calls to FC and checking my email in my FC account, I just simply dont get any VS promotional emails. Odd. Anyway. I too have been getting infuriated by the almost constant creeping up of the taxes/surcharges/blatant made up extras that VS seem to be applying. It is really devaluing any point of purchasing a reward seat in Y. In some cases the I have seen the fare being about £50 of the overall cost. Why would ANYONE want to part with circa 30k points for a £50 discount that you can often achieve by using the standard 2000 points plus cash. My girlfriend got really excited when she saw the email, but after 30 secs of a quick explanation of the actual mechanic that VS are trying to achieve, then even as a relative FC novice, she saw right through it.
It just seems like a massive ploy to get the uneducated to dump a few thousand points and fill Y seats at almost sale fares. As a usual massive VS ambassador, things like this are more often these days making even the most die hard fan like me lose faith. VS take note!!!!!!!

Can I just add that I don't get the promotional emails either. I am fully signed up to the FC, fly 2-3 times a year, yet my mother-in-law who rarely flies with VS, always gets them! Strange, but any offers seem to be discussed on here, so I am glad I can get a 'proper' version of the offers.

Hi again, In this instance I really think I want to defend VS on this one

A friend of mine is a Las Vegas junky, going over 4/5 times a year just to gamble.

Anyway she always travels in economy - preferring to save her cash "for the tables" - takes all sorts

She has just booked 2 seats with this VS offer of 2 for 1, travelling mid-April for 5 nights LGW-LAS.

It has cost them £614.80 (£307.90 x two) for taxes and surcharges + 47,500 miles for the one reward flight.

On the current VS website the cheapest two seats, same dates, works out at £1363.80 for the two fares. Yes of course they've cashed in 47,500 miles but if you book reward flights thats what happens.

Those figures do effectively mean one free flight when you callulate it out.

So in my opinion VS are not really giving misleading information.
Agree????

Hi again, In this instance I really think I want to defend VS on this one

A friend of mine is a Las Vegas junky, going over 4/5 times a year just to gamble.

Anyway she always travels in economy - preferring to save her cash "for the tables" - takes all sorts

She has just booked 2 seats with this VS offer of 2 for 1, travelling mid-April for 5 nights LGW-LAS.

It has cost them £614.80 (£307.90 x two) for taxes and surcharges + 47,500 miles for the one reward flight.

On the current VS website the cheapest two seats, same dates, works out at £1363.80 for the two fares. Yes of course they've cashed in 47,500 miles but if you book reward flights thats what happens.

Those figures do effectively mean one free flight when you callulate it out.

So in my opinion VS are not really giving misleading information.
Agree????

In short - No.

Whilst the offer may be attractive when compared with a revenue ticket -full fare or otherwise - it's not comparing like with like.

Whilst there may be individual savings to be made on particular routings, overall, I think it's a poor offer.

[Neil]

In short - No.

Whilst the offer may be attractive when compared with a revenue ticket -full fare or otherwise - it's not comparing like with like.

Whilst there may be individual savings to be made on particular routings, overall, I think it's a poor offer.

But that is the thing, what doesn't work for you, works well for someone else, unfortunately there will be VERY few offers by any company that works well and suits every potential customer.

There are obviously infrequent, leisure travellers who have built up a few miles over a few years, who only care about the lowest price they can pay, and as highlighted a couple of times in this thread alone, those pax can make a fairly decent saving.

For the more regular, miles savvy pax, whose end goal is best value possible from the miles, then of course this offer doesn't offer enough of a saving.

Of course this is totally different matter to the whole wording of the offer, which could be classed as misleading, but it is unfair to criticise the deal just because it doesn't suit your personal situation.

To me its an offer for people who don't value their miles.

I know people seem to deem them to be free, be them earned on flights or via the 150 quid credit card (thats a cost, that fee alone).

I value them according to the buy miles cost, at 150 quid per 10,000. No, I'm not buying those miles (I did a while back though), but I'm putting a value on them.

So 614 + 47500 miles vs 1363 (not a great economy price there, but theres not been any great sales on recently, so you get what you can take).

Firstly its not really 47500, its that plus the miles you don't earn, 10,000 miles (2x5000), so real cost in miles is 57500. So under my system, the cost would be:

614 + (5.5 x 150) = 1439.

This is just my way of calculating this, sure people can argue over the actual value of the miles, I find it useful to see if a UC price is good value vs an L + miles upgrade if available, but miles do have value, that is, if you intend to be loyal to the airline. If you don't, then its a case of dump em and and fly via someone else, which is perhaps the customer they are targetting here....