Upper Class Bar Whilst Flying Econ

Totally In agreement with both Gumshoe and Ritchie

PS my experience of getting given champagne in premium as an AU member got this response from a friend "my money is as good as yours and I paid as much as you so why can't I get some champagne!". It's great when travelling on your own but in a group (like your LAS flight) it could be unwanted attention you don't want!!!

Surely the answer is pretty obvious?! If you're Au, then over time you're paying way more, hence the reward for being loyal. Thus, you totally deserve a champers over your mate.

I started this thread and then I upgraded much further up the plane as my travelling friend pulled out at the last min.
Whilst all the answers have a valid side to them I do wonder if it matters what side of the fence you sit on. Most of my flying is business to UC or PE is the norm.
As a customer I show VS loyalty by flying into some airports that are not first choice, Newark for example when traveling to Philly, I change at Chicago to go elsewhere and fly to Delhi to fly on internally.
If I make these changes, some add to my own cost, then, and sorry to blunt here, I expect VS to go the extra mile.
I want them to give me preferred seating if in Econ., I want extra miles, and I want and like a "welcome back Mr / Mrs X" if in econ. If in econ the normal VS passenger would be, I would think, on their once a year vacation flight and happy to be going. If they want to ask why I am sure as a fully trained crew they could explain in a very nice way why they welcomed me back.

Sorry if that sounds blunt, I mean no malice or disrespect to anyone fellow pax. It's just my viewpoint.
J

PS my experience of getting given champagne in premium as an AU member got this response from a friend "my money is as good as yours and I paid as much as you so why can't I get some champagne!". It's great when travelling on your own but in a group (like your LAS flight) it could be unwanted attention you don't want!!!

Surely the answer is pretty obvious?! If you're Au, then over time you're paying way more, hence the reward for being loyal. Thus, you totally deserve a champers over your mate.

I agree with AU passengers getting a glass of champers, but in your seat, in your class, which you have paid for.

I started this thread and then I upgraded much further up the plane as my travelling friend pulled out at the last min.
Whilst all the answers have a valid side to them I do wonder if it matters what side of the fence you sit on. Most of my flying is business to UC or PE is the norm.
As a customer I show VS loyalty by flying into some airports that are not first choice, Newark for example when traveling to Philly, I change at Chicago to go elsewhere and fly to Delhi to fly on internally.
If I make these changes, some add to my own cost, then, and sorry to blunt here, I expect VS to go the extra mile.
I want them to give me preferred seating if in Econ., I want extra miles, and I want and like a "welcome back Mr / Mrs X" if in econ. If in econ the normal VS passenger would be, I would think, on their once a year vacation flight and happy to be going. If they want to ask why I am sure as a fully trained crew they could explain in a very nice way why they welcomed me back.

Sorry if that sounds blunt, I mean no malice or disrespect to anyone fellow pax. It's just my viewpoint.
J

Being VS gold has defined benefits, other elite programs have different benefits. If you travel a lot and another program has benefits to suit your needs, perhaps you should look to that program, rather than expect the VS program to meet your additional expectations.

I just don't get the argument that it's costing me extra to stay loyal with you, so you should give me more.

Oh, and when I'm on my once a year vacation in economy, 'happy to be going', I do not not expect others in the cabin to get blatantly preferential treatment.

It almost sounds like you want to be visible to other economy customers as an 'elite', as in; 'I'm not normally this side of the fence so I need special attention'.

(Yes, I did find some 'disrespect' in the post)

...

I want them to give me preferred seating if in Econ., I want extra miles, and I want and like a "welcome back Mr / Mrs X" if in econ. If in econ the normal VS passenger would be, I would think, on their once a year vacation flight and happy to be going. If they want to ask why I am sure as a fully trained crew they could explain in a very nice way why they welcomed me back.

Being VS gold has defined benefits, other elite programs have different benefits. If you travel a lot and another program has benefits to suit your needs, perhaps you should look to that program, rather than expect the VS program to meet your additional expectations.

I just don't get the argument that it's costing me extra to stay loyal with you, so you should give me more.

Oh, and when I'm on my once a year vacation in economy, 'happy to be going', I do not not expect others in the cabin to get blatantly preferential treatment.

It almost sounds like you want to be visible to other economy customers as an 'elite', as in; 'I'm not normally this side of the fence so I need special attention'.

(Yes, I did find some 'disrespect' in the post)

I see no disrespect and seriously, are you suggesting that VS should not put on extra to retain high spending frequent fliers? Perhaps you don't work in the industry ): .

There's often a split in view on V-Flyer between those who fly once or twice a year on their own dime and those who fly very regularly. Such views are not always reconcilable so we may well agree to differ. From my pov I don't want to see the blatent preferential treatment that US airlines meet out, such as free upgrades from any cheap fare, but I do think VS can do more for its frequent fliers - if you're in Y would you know that the person in the bulkhead got a preferred pre-seating request for example, and often someone gets a quick glass of champagne (honeymoners, friends, Au's etc.) and should that stop?

I tend to agree with LovingGold on this issue. As is often said, "we know you have a choice ..." and to earn loyalty and future revenue, airlines do understand this. There's no harm in urging VS to do a little more.

Like I said, I agree with the having champers at your seat but as a frequent flyer in UC, speaking to the crew about the flight and finding out how many gold cards there are onboard, sometimes on certain routes there can be as many as 45 UC passengers with sometimes 10 AU passengers in premium and a couple down the back in Y. So on the 600 with the bar being built for a max of 8 people (including the crew) to occupy can you see how it would be impossible to entertain all the AU passengers at the bar along with the UC passengers. As the W and Y seats are not as comfortable as the J seat those passengers, I can imagine, will spend the majority of the time propping up the bar. It would be a nightmare. And it wouldn't make a difference if the flight was quiet and it was ok on those flights because it would then become the 'norm' and on busy flights if the 'perk' was taken off the AU passengers, they would be complaining. More agro then it's worth and the incentive to fly upper would be less and the exclusive bar product would be diluted.

...

I want them to give me preferred seating if in Econ., I want extra miles, and I want and like a "welcome back Mr / Mrs X" if in econ. If in econ the normal VS passenger would be, I would think, on their once a year vacation flight and happy to be going. If they want to ask why I am sure as a fully trained crew they could explain in a very nice way why they welcomed me back.

Being VS gold has defined benefits, other elite programs have different benefits. If you travel a lot and another program has benefits to suit your needs, perhaps you should look to that program, rather than expect the VS program to meet your additional expectations.

I just don't get the argument that it's costing me extra to stay loyal with you, so you should give me more.

Oh, and when I'm on my once a year vacation in economy, 'happy to be going', I do not not expect others in the cabin to get blatantly preferential treatment.

It almost sounds like you want to be visible to other economy customers as an 'elite', as in; 'I'm not normally this side of the fence so I need special attention'.

(Yes, I did find some 'disrespect' in the post)

I see no disrespect and seriously, are you suggesting that VS should not put on extra to retain high spending frequent fliers? Perhaps you don't work in the industry ): .

There's often a split in view on V-Flyer between those who fly once or twice a year on their own dime and those who fly very regularly. Such views are not always reconcilable so we may well agree to differ. From my pov I don't want to see the blatent preferential treatment that US airlines meet out, such as free upgrades from any cheap fare, but I do think VS can do more for its frequent fliers - if you're in Y would you know that the person in the bulkhead got a preferred pre-seating request for example, and often someone gets a quick glass of champagne (honeymoners, friends, Au's etc.) and should that stop?

I tend to agree with LovingGold on this issue. As is often said, "we know you have a choice ..." and to earn loyalty and future revenue, airlines do understand this. There's no harm in urging VS to do a little more.

I don't think I said that VS shouldn't appeal to it's frequent fliers. Of course VS wants to attract and keep high spenders and should craft it's program to do so.

Where the benefit is defined there is no issue and undefined benefits can be the cream on top that help retain loyalty. However, I don't think it is necessarily right to demand them.

This thread has made me so angry - nothing to do with the contents though. I spent half an hour last night crafting a reply that I thought would be balanced as I know these can by quite contentious, then I hit the 'submit' button and it disappeared into the ether !

Anyway, hopefully I can see this from both sides as I reached the heady heights of AU for 3 years but have now lost it.

PS my experience of getting given champagne in premium as an AU member got this response from a friend "my money is as good as yours and I paid as much as you so why can't I get some champagne!".

As Simonalladyce has mentioned, he obviously isn't spending as much as you. You could have told him that he could get exactly the same service as you if he chose to spend £15-20k pa with VS.

The extra leg room seats were created specifically to help generate much needed revenue ....

Is this not a fairly short termist view. Yes, by all means maximise the revenue, but does it make sense to get an extra £30 from a one or two times traveller at the expense of someone who spends £15-20k pa.

There was someone on here a while back who achieved Au by travelling only in Y (all I can say is 'Respect' oo) ). That is a hell of a lot of 'spend' with one airline and a bit of recognition I guess would go a long way in keeping his business.

All businesses must treat customers differently. They reward their highest revenue stream. Business isn't some sort of egalitarian Utopia (as I can hear Todd Rundgren in the kitchen !).

When an Au I would have been more than happy with a name check, which never happened - and these cost diddly squat.

As to the OP, I don't think a trip to the bar is on as others have noted, that would be a logistical nightmare. It could take services away from those that have paid for it. All the other points are only an 'addition' to what you would receive in Y or W and therefore should not 'impact' passengers in those cabins.

I guess the sheer fact that this thread materialises in many guises over the years proves it is a contentious issue and people have different perspectives on it.

spiceke

There was someone on here a while back who achieved Au by travelling only in Y (all I can say is 'Respect' oo) ). That is a hell of a lot of 'spend' with one airline and a bit of recognition I guess would go a long way in keeping his business.

And fair play to them but think of the benefits that this person gets by being AU

Access to the CH so a 'value' of £60 (at LHR) (double that if taking a guest)
Extra Bag Allowance - a 'value' of £30-40
Priority Baggage
Bonus Miles

Surely that is the 'reward' for being such a freqent flyer?

As to a glass of something sparkling on board I don't have a problem with that. I do admit the first time I saw it I did the 'I wonder why THEY are so special' thought but then I heard it was because they were a very frequent flyers so then I had the 'Well I hope to be in their position someday!'

But I would not be in favour of access to the bar - sometimes it is hard enough to get a seat as it is.

Not sure either about 'free' extra leg room seats or priority seat selection. Given the number of AU pax on some routes you will still end up dissapointing some people - so maybe VS have chosen the 'lets dissapoint everyone' method.

The extra leg room seats were created specifically to help generate much needed revenue ....

Is this not a fairly short termist view. Yes, by all means maximise the revenue, but does it make sense to get an extra £30 from a one or two times traveller at the expense of someone who spends £15-20k

spiceke

I see your point, but would you choose NOT to fly with Virgin because you can't get for free what others have paid for. For example, before I chose to work I the industry myself, I travelled around the world numerous times a year on my own expense and reached Silver on United's Milage Plus, every time I flew with them from that point I was automatically "upgraded" to economyplus extra legroom seat. However, had this not been the case, I would have still chosen to fly with them because I wanted the miles! Virgin's Au members travelling in economy get to use Upper check in desks, extra baggage allowance, Upper security point, access to Clubhouse and priority boarding. It's unfair to say they don't get looked after.

Just to add another slant on this debate, take Lagos, it probably has the highest percentage of Au members or any one flight in the network, a huge amount. Even in economy you might get 20-30 Au. It would be unfair to allow or give Au members extras on a JFK flight that would would not be able to offer on a Lagos. Inconsistency can be an issue as it is without our highly valued Lagos customers feeling like the crew do not have either the time or the resources to offer them the same preferential treatment.

Three points:

1. I think the whole status recognition thing can get a bit invidious really. I am not at all opposed to benefits such as lounge access or extra miles or preferential seating, but I suspect that the desire to be brought a glass of champagne in Y has rather little to do with continued loyalty and rather a lot to do with ego.

2. Besides, there is a slippage in some of the arguments here. The customer is not necessarily the passenger. I would think that an awful lot of high-status passengers earn their status (and most of their miles!) thanks to their companies. I trust/hope that VS put more time and effort into retaining the big customers rather than pampering their employees when they are off on their hols in Y!

3. The VS champagne is not worth all this fuss anyway!

Three points:
I would think that an awful lot of high-status passengers earn their status (and most of their miles!) thanks to their companies. I trust/hope that VS put more time and effort into retaining the big customers rather than pampering their employees when they are off on their hols in Y!

That is quite a big leap. I am not sure that VS care where their revenue comes from - it is your bum on the seat. I think the scheme is a 'frequent flier' not a 'frequent payer' scheme. For that, I believe, there is a separate Corporate scheme available?

Just to add another slant on this debate, take Lagos, it probably has the highest percentage of Au members or any one flight in the network, a huge amount. Even in economy you might get 20-30 Au. It would be unfair to allow or give Au members extras on a JFK flight that would would not be able to offer on a Lagos. Inconsistency can be an issue as it is without our highly valued Lagos customers feeling like the crew do not have either the time or the resources to offer them the same preferential treatment.

That is an excellent point. Where there are finite resources / availability I would agree 100% - and I guess the extra leg room seats may fall into this category. A glass of Champagne (even the offer of one as I do not drink !) is a nice gesture which costs virtually nothing, but makes a difference.

Re-reading this thread, I am not necessarily advocating one form of 'benefit' over the other, but anything that VS do to recognise the revenue generators cannot be a bad thing - and this is from someone who no longer would 'benefit' from this.

Spiceke

I agree with AU passengers getting a glass of champers, but in your seat, in your class, which you have paid for.

I agree. Having recently completed 6 sectors in PE, I got lounge access and on one of those sectors a glass of shampoo in my seat (the same sector I got the name check on - but maybe the ex-SYD ground staff/crew more clued up, of a sunnier disposition?).

Best ever was upgrade from Economy to UC - especially delicious as I ended up sitting opposite the chap who'd been giving me and my partner evils in the CH.

But in general you deserve what you pay for - and a little extra is a bonus!

If you want access to the UC bar, buy a UC ticket.

I think it's been said before that the invite to the bar should only be if it's quiet in UC on the day. Similarly, the reservation of extra leg room seats could be offered occasionally where operationally convenient.

On the issue of the personal welcome back, while it's not written down as one of the privileges of AU, it's obviously something extra that is or was supposed to be offered as I recall the issue of the emails asking if you were welcomed back by name.

I agree the little extra are nice when received such as a name check or making sure you get your choice of meal. The glass of champagne - only happened once but was a nice touch.

I had one question for those who think it should become the norm. More often than no when travelling in Y or W on holiday people often are with their wife / husband / partner. So when the Au member gets their champagne - how does that work for the relationship there?
1. Explain that they should travel more and then they would get it

2. Offer it to the wife / husband / partner as they travel less so will probably have less on board champagne every year

3. Expect the FSM to get their respective other half a glass as well

Not an easy one to get right!! It can be a very long flight / holiday if you get it wrong

I agree the little extra are nice when received such as a name check or making sure you get your choice of meal. The glass of champagne - only happened once but was a nice touch.

I had one question for those who think it should become the norm. More often than no when travelling in Y or W on holiday people often are with their wife / husband / partner. So when the Au member gets their champagne - how does that work for the relationship there?
1. Explain that they should travel more and then they would get it

2. Offer it to the wife / husband / partner as they travel less so will probably have less on board champagne every year

3. Expect the FSM to get their respective other half a glass as well

Not an easy one to get right!! It can be a very long flight / holiday if you get it wrong

A fair question, and one that crossed my mind as well. My reasoning is that given that the wife/husband/partner should at least be AG status, they should perhaps get half a glass of champagne. Or maybe a glass of PE cava.

I for one am sure that my wife would be happy with that. She knows her place. Just as I know mine xx( B)