New Premium Economy/Economy Layout

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone could tell me what it is like to travel with the new layout in the bubble on the newly refurbished plane Barbarella?

I know it is now split in half and i've seen some pictures of it.

Can the economy passengers use the toilet at the front or do they have to go downstaris?

Is the curtain drawn so it seperates the two classes?

Do the same staff serve everyone up there?

Any info would be appreciated.

Cheers

[Neil]

From what I have read on other forums, the curtain is drawn upstairs but the economy pax can use either the toilet at the front or the economy toilet downstairs.

We haven't had any TR's from the new config yet, but certainly when I eventually fly on the new config in PE I will be choosing a seat in the new, larger downstairs cabin as I feel this will offer the best PE experience.

Neil

There are two crew upstairs and they serve both the premium economy and economy pax

From what I have read on other forums, the curtain is drawn upstairs but the economy pax can use either the toilet at the front or the economy toilet downstairs.

We haven't had any TR's from the new config yet, but certainly when I eventually fly on the new config in PE I will be choosing a seat in the new, larger downstairs cabin as I feel this will offer the best PE experience.

Neil

Neil, do you think the new downsatirs will be anything more than an enlargement of the existing pokey (and a lot of people are convinced less leg room) one ? if it is IMO it isnt worth it. but then going back upstairs (if you can get up there at all) creates new problems.
i still remain unconvinced

There are two crew upstairs and they serve both the premium economy and economy pax

Is it my imagination or did the website (very recently) refer to "dedicated cabin crew" for PE? I notice it doesn't say that now, which is as it should be if they are no longer dedicated given the new layout.

I've just posted a comparison of PE versus BA WTP where I've said PE has dedicated cabin crew and BA WTP doesn't. Typical, just as I sing their praises they go and change things!

[mitchja]

Isn't it the same for the upper deck on the LHR 744's though as well. 2 crew looking after both J and Y?

I think the reason for it is there simply isn't enough room on the upper deck for anymore than 2 crew?

[Neil]

Neil, do you think the new downstairs will be anything more than an enlargement of the existing pokey (and a lot of people are convinced less leg room) one ? if it is IMO it isn't worth it. but then going back upstairs (if you can get up there at all) creates new problems.
I still remain unconvinced

I think it will be a lot better. It will be just like the PE cabin on the LHR 747's (although ever so slightly shorter). It will be purely PE pax with only the 14 J pax in front of you and you will be perfectly located for exiting the a/c first.

Of course it isn't going to be the same as the exclusive PE bubble, but that is going and there is nothing we can do about it, so for me the larger downstairs cabin will still offer an excellent PE product and experience.

It will be interesting to see which one offers the best PE experience now that it is mixed in the bubble. Having flown PE in the past I imagine it would take something away from the experience being in the same cabin and sharing the same staff and facilities as economy passengers.

I might be wrong though so it would be good to hear from someone who has experienced it first hand.

The new seats in PE look really good and so does the new entertainment system.

Whatever they do / have done with the PE refit, they need to make sure it is NOT the same as the 2 class A330 leisure aircraft.

Having had the misfortune to travel home MCO - GLA last year on one of these, and looking like it will be the same this year, I can categorically say that the seat pitch on those aircraft is NOT 38".

When I reclined my seat, my wife behind (each of us sat next to one of our sons) almost had her legs cut off. Result - no reclining for me. She has had more legroom on an Easyjet cattle truck.

I am taking tape measure this time to prove that pitch is NOT 38" as advertised.

But suffice to say that unless the PE "package" is substantially better than the EC package, having travelled VS exclusively for all trans atlantic & far east journeys for almost 2 decades, I will not be back.

The pricing comparison means that you would expect better seat, legroom & ob board service.

We'll see.

Of course seat pitch is not the same as leg room.

Seat pitch is is the distance between part of one seat and the same position on the seat in front (or the other way around).

The seat pitch remains constant if both seats are in the same angle of recline. The problem arises when the person in front reclines. If the squab (the bit your plant bottom on) dosn't move them your leg room will be reduced. Reclining will maintain your seat pitch but not your leg room.

Confusingly, the VS site mostly talks about seat pitch then throws in the odd "leg room" for luck.

My experience of the A330 2 cabin PE was very good, but I had an empty seat in front of me. All the same I did recline the seat in front as an experiment and although my leg room was reduced, I still had enough room. But I have short thighs. I would have been 6' otherwise.

I thought the PE cabin and service were excellent.

its leg room thats key for me. i suffer really bad knees (too much sport) and being cramped in one position for too long literally leaves me unable to stand. i am totally positive having flown on LGW747s up and down, LHR 747s and A340s that the better leg room is in the bubble. after that its close but I found the donwstairs cabin on a LGW 747 to be the worst.

in all honesty if the choice was a PE downstairs or exit row in EC , i think now the EC exit would win.

I can deal with the lesser food etc, comfort is my no 1 priority , then quick exit, then food, then IFE.

[Neil]

Whatever they do / have done with the PE refit, they need to make sure it is NOT the same as the 2 class A330 leisure aircraft.

Having had the misfortune to travel home MCO - GLA last year on one of these, and looking like it will be the same this year, I can categorically say that the seat pitch on those aircraft is NOT 38".

When I reclined my seat, my wife behind (each of us sat next to one of our sons) almost had her legs cut off. Result - no reclining for me. She has had more legroom on an Easyjet cattle truck.

I am taking tape measure this time to prove that pitch is NOT 38" as advertised.

But suffice to say that unless the PE "package" is substantially better than the EC package, having travelled VS exclusively for all trans atlantic & far east journeys for almost 2 decades, I will not be back.

The pricing comparison means that you would expect better seat, legroom & ob board service.

We'll see.

If you are purely comparing the A330 PE to the PE cabin upstairs on the LGW747 then the seat pitch is less, but that is only because the seat pitch upstairs is quite a bit more than 38".

The A330 PE seat pitch is 38" and is exactly the same as in the A346 and LHR 747's.

Whatever they do / have done with the PE refit, they need to make sure it is NOT the same as the 2 class A330 leisure aircraft.

Having had the misfortune to travel home MCO - GLA last year on one of these, and looking like it will be the same this year, I can categorically say that the seat pitch on those aircraft is NOT 38".

When I reclined my seat, my wife behind (each of us sat next to one of our sons) almost had her legs cut off. Result - no reclining for me. She has had more legroom on an Easyjet cattle truck.
I am taking tape measure this time to prove that pitch is NOT 38" as advertised.

But suffice to say that unless the PE "package" is substantially better than the EC package, having travelled VS exclusively for all trans atlantic & far east journeys for almost 2 decades, I will not be back.

The pricing comparison means that you would expect better seat, legroom & ob board service.

We'll see.

! We took a quick trip and flew PE (MIA). I agree, the recline of the seat in front nearly took my knees off! xx( I'm only 5'2" and hadn't flown PE for a while, John could hardly fit in the seat, when we were up in the bubble in the old days it was never a problem ii) . The PE experience was horrible and not enjoyable for the price at all. UC service was bad enough but this was ridiculous.

We always used to fly VA PE with the 3 Children, they grew up and we went to BA CW, then VA UC. ): BA CW is winning for us at the moment, at least they treat us like paying customers and not an inconvenience. Out of our last 6 UC flights, 2 have been acceptable. :0

Isn't it the same for the upper deck on the LHR 744's though as well. 2 crew looking after both J and Y?

I think the reason for it is there simply isn't enough room on the upper deck for anymore than 2 crew?

James - on the LHR config aircraft, three crew work upstairs. One in Y, one in the galley & J and one dedicated crew member in J - the service in UC upstairs is very attentive indeed.

The CSS also pops up to help with the wine service and the FSM has helped with the afternoon tea service on my last few flights when uptairs in J.

Jon

...

in all honesty if the choice was a PE downstairs or exit row in EC , i think now the EC exit would win.

I can deal with the lesser food etc, comfort is my no 1 priority , then quick exit, then food, then IFE.

Another knee sufferer so empathise totally and agree with your comparison.

I loved the PE product in the bubble but those days will be gone soon.

I don't care how spacious they advertise the new downstairs PE cabin as being - 8 seats across x six rows will still feel darn claustrophobic in my opinion, and more importantly certainly not worth a £1000 more per seat (Easter 2013 fare) v(

I was really hoping my first PE experience was going to be on a newly refitted 747. How I'm starting to hope Im on an old one! . In the bubble. Please can someone give me a load check 11/07/12 lgw- las. Trip report will follow . Thank you
18/07/12 las- lgw

Whatever they do / have done with the PE refit, they need to make sure it is NOT the same as the 2 class A330 leisure aircraft.

Having had the misfortune to travel home MCO - GLA last year on one of these, and looking like it will be the same this year, I can categorically say that the seat pitch on those aircraft is NOT 38".

When I reclined my seat, my wife behind (each of us sat next to one of our sons) almost had her legs cut off. Result - no reclining for me. She has had more legroom on an Easyjet cattle truck.

I am taking tape measure this time to prove that pitch is NOT 38" as advertised.

But suffice to say that unless the PE "package" is substantially better than the EC package, having travelled VS exclusively for all trans atlantic & far east journeys for almost 2 decades, I will not be back.

The pricing comparison means that you would expect better seat, legroom & ob board service.

We'll see.

If you are purely comparing the A330 PE to the PE cabin upstairs on the LGW747 then the seat pitch is less, but that is only because the seat pitch upstairs is quite a bit more than 38".

The A330 PE seat pitch is 38" and is exactly the same as in the A346 and LHR 747's.

We had this discussion ages ago on another thread. At the same time the A330s were introduced the VS website changed to 37 inches. link

! We took a quick trip and flew PE (MIA). I agree, the recline of the seat in front nearly took my knees off! xx( I'm only 5'2" and hadn't flown PE for a while, John could hardly fit in the seat, when we were up in the bubble in the old days it was never a problem ii) . The PE experience was horrible and not enjoyable for the price at all. UC service was bad enough but this was ridiculous.

We always used to fly VA PE with the 3 Children, they grew up and we went to BA CW, then VA UC. ): BA CW is winning for us at the moment, at least they treat us like paying customers and not an inconvenience. Out of our last 6 UC flights, 2 have been acceptable. :0

Ouch, that is not good feed back for the VS PE.

We done PE from Boston, JFK, Chicago and MIA over the years and compared with the LGW PE bubble it was not worth the money on the LHW routes.

Personally, sooooo looking forward to experiencing the Air NewZealand PE product, even the two seats in the middle look perfectly ok

by daviec1 » 21 Jun 2012, 14:49

Whatever they do / have done with the PE refit, they need to make sure it is NOT the same as the 2 class A330 leisure aircraft.

Having had the misfortune to travel home MCO - GLA last year on one of these, and looking like it will be the same this year, I can categorically say that the seat pitch on those aircraft is NOT 38".

The new info on the virgin website now states "up to 38 inches seat pitch", which seems to confirm suspicions that some are definitely less than 38 inches.

[honey lamb]

BA CW is winning for us at the moment, at least they treat us like paying customers and not an inconvenience.

Hmmm, my experiences have been just the opposite

I think PE in the bubble has spoiled a lot of people here. Rather than being an extra selling point over normal PE seats, it's become the de facto standard. PE on the LHR 747s and A346's is not a bad product at all, especially when compared to its main rival BA WT+ (as highlighted in a recent trip report).

I'm 6ft and thoroughly enjoyed both my experiences in PE thus far, space not being a problem at all. Perhaps cramped flights in economy are still fresh in my mind though.

I have never flown VS out of LGW but I'm guessing that the PE seats in those A/C are the old cloth ones which I remember from years ago. While I agree that they do offer more space when the seat in front is reclined, I think that the purple seat is so much more comfortable (but then, my memories of the old seat are vague).

On the issue of the mixed cabin, while I understand the irritation, it's been mixed upstairs on the LHR 747s and UC pax have had to live with it so PE pax just have to do the same.

On the issue of customer feedback, I'm sure you'll find that the Y pax would have clamoured for seats in the bubble and by sheer numbers, they outvote all premium pax. So if VS's criteria is something like 7 out of 10 pax think that Y seats should be in the bubble, then so be it.

Just wondering with the new config in the bubble how will PE passengers get to exit first when they arrive at mco how will the cabin crew stop y passengers getting off at the same time. One of the reasons I've booked PE in the past is PE passengers are able to disembark first thus avoiding the very long queue at immigration.

[Neil]

Just wondering with the new config in the bubble how will PE passengers get to exit first when they arrive at mco how will the cabin crew stop y passengers getting off at the same time. One of the reasons I've booked PE in the past is PE passengers are able to disembark first thus avoiding the very long queue at immigration.

If you are in the downstairs PE cabin on the new config you should be first off the a/c as they will hold all of the Y downstairs pax back, however if you are upstairs you will just disembark after the Y pax.

It would be extremely impractical to get the 5/6 rows of Y pax to wait while the front half of the bubble disembarked, and in reality there are only a few more people ahead of you compared to an all PE bubble, so it really is a non issue. It is exactly the same for UC pax on the split UC/Y upper deck on the LHR 747's.

Neil

Does this mean then if you are a y passenger in the bubble of the new config you will get off earlier than the rest of the Y passengers ? And will these Y seats in the bubble have a premium attached to them to sit in the bubble