Little Red - Closing down

[honey lamb]

I heard a rumour that Aer Lingus has first refusal on the slots.

Does anyone think that if it was the case that Aer Lingus took the slots, this would/could pave the way for a codeshare agreement in order to provide feeder traffic onto the long haul VS network?

Dan

Would Aer Lingus be allowed to operate a route entirely within the UK other than the Belfast-LHR/LGW routes?

I don't see why not - Ryanair do.

The plan was stuck in Branson Buccaneering world and would never work. That awful advert!

So what next - end PVG, doesn't fit and a useful slot. Would like to see BOM re-instated- good premium loads and US transfer traffic in an evening slot though. Mustn't compromise US. A new US flight ex LHR- MSP? SLC? SEA? SAN? on VS metal?

We certainly can forget any previously unserved destinations outside of the US now I think- Rio etc. is firmly dreamland. As I have said it's all about UK-US/US-London feed.

FF's think US and low availability at that! But as I have said the airline still lost £500K a month last year and DL will stop that at any price.

Somehow I think at best we're likely to see an increased frequency to a US destination/DL hub destination with the additional slot. The plan is firmly on returning to profit which for VS clearly means targeting the US. Only once profitability is restored can I see VS potentially announcing new routes outside of the US....which are generally tougher markets to crack, though that'd be years down the line.

Whilst this is a sad announcement I think people need to remember that VS was a structurally unprofitable organisation. It has been profitably once in the last four years with a record loss in the final year of Ridgeways tenure.

The stark reality is that had DL not come along, VS may well have disappeared altogether.

Regarding DL making decisions, it's perfectly normal for a large investor with a minority shareholding. Have a look at dragons den for a small-scale example. DL knows that if they pulled the plug on VS, they'd both suffer.

The days of emotionally led or 'to say we fly there' led decisions as gone. VS will fly where it makes cash and once profitable, go from there.

VS already fly direct from MAN to MCO, LAS and BGI though, so I can't imagine the demand for connections on to the handful of other LGW routes is anywhere near sufficient to justify MAN-LGW.

These are all seasonal right? I wasn't even aware of the BGI route (is that summer or winter?). Or is MCO all the year around (not of interest to me)?

Isn't the Carribean a winter preferred destination, ie: high season is November to February? I'd think there would be some demand for connecting to this.

I heard a rumour that Aer Lingus has first refusal on the slots.

Does anyone think that if it was the case that Aer Lingus took the slots, this would/could pave the way for a codeshare agreement in order to provide feeder traffic onto the long haul VS network?

Dan

Would Aer Lingus be allowed to operate a route entirely within the UK other than the Belfast-LHR/LGW routes?

Yes, and were one of the bidders first time round.

I think they shot themselves in the foot by starting with Manchester. It's just too close to be worthwhile.

Sure, flying from Heathrow, it makes a difference, but its 2 hours and 15 minutes by train from Manchester to Euston. 10 minutes in a taxi. 15 minutes on the HEX. Probably the cost of the last two is the same as the flight though, but it means that its timescale equivalent (when you consider check in time, getting to airport from centre of Manchester).

One flaw smid I recently had to book a 2 hr train from Wigan to London day return at short notice £328 against a bit of a wait and a little messing around circa £120

I know facebook is not reliable in terms of customer feedback but I saw several people saying that they would have flown VS to e.g. the Caribbean if they operated MAN-LGW rather than LHR because they didn't want to have to transit LHR-LGW adding 3-4 hours onto the journey time.

VS already fly direct from MAN to MCO, LAS and BGI though, so I can't imagine the demand for connections on to the handful of other LGW routes is anywhere near sufficient to justify MAN-LGW.

I was only saying what I had read on the VS face book page when LR started that some people had said they would have preferred LR to fly into LGW. Though of course if they had done that there would have been comments that it should have been LHR!

These are all seasonal right? I wasn't even aware of the BGI route (is that summer or winter?). Or is MCO all the year around (not of interest to me)?

Isn't the Carribean a winter preferred destination, ie: high season is November to February? I'd think there would be some demand for connecting to this.

MAN-LAS is summer only I believe but MAN-MCO and MAN-BGI are year round, so I can't imagine demand for MAN-LGW is sufficient to have justified a LR route.

MAN-LAS is summer only I believe but MAN-MCO and MAN-BGI are year round, so I can't imagine demand for MAN-LGW is sufficient to have justified a LR route.

But EDI - LGW would have worked. After many years of travelling down to LGW for my departures from EDI, you soon realise a; how many travellers on the Virgin flights join you on the BA flights back to Scotland and b; how terrible BA's flight times are.

You can be stuck in LGW waiting for your shuttle for up to 4 hours after landing from the US. Not what you want after an over night flight home.

However, it's not to be.

David

MAN-LAS is summer only I believe but MAN-MCO and MAN-BGI are year round, so I can't imagine demand for MAN-LGW is sufficient to have justified a LR route.

But EDI - LGW would have worked. After many years of travelling down to LGW for my departures from EDI, you soon realise a; how many travellers on the Virgin flights join you on the BA flights back to Scotland and b; how terrible BA's flight times are.

You can be stuck in LGW waiting for your shuttle for up to 4 hours after landing from the US. Not what you want after an over night flight home.

However, it's not to be.

David

Virgin should codeshare with EasyJet and FlyBe.

Virgin should codeshare with EasyJet and FlyBe.

I can't see EasyJet doing codeshares. It would run counter their whole point-point ethos.

They would also have to accept the risks when passengers and luggage are delayed on connecting flights and the costs associated with that.

Was just putting the idea out there for discussion. Win-win as far as I see it, they get extra revenue and share some of the risks, Virgin get to tap into an existing domestic network.

MAN-LAS is summer only I believe but MAN-MCO and MAN-BGI are year round, so I can't imagine demand for MAN-LGW is sufficient to have justified a LR route.

Do you know what, this thread is the first time I've ever found out they flew MAN-BGI, and find it rather shocking it's all the year round as well...

Sometimes VS doesn't do a good job of advertising its routes... I've still little idea what they do from Glasgow either.

A bit late to this thread but I'm also really sorry to hear that LR is being cancelled. It's a real shame that VS didn't give it the full 3 years to pick-up, as I would've thought that another 18 months would see an improvement in pax load. I've used the EDI and ABZ services, and have very much enjoyed both with no issues. As someone who will be doing LHR-ABZ fairly regularly, I will sure miss the LR's existence.

I'm quite tempted by the FC offers on this route, and as I'm in need of a few TPs to get to AU in the next few months, I might just do a few more LR trips before they end...

Really sad about this. Just got off my 99th Little Red flight in EDI. The EDI based crew said they had all been offered jobs with VS mainline, although they may not take those up - it's a very different lifestyle.

I'll be on my 100th LR sector tomorrow - again with a Scottish crew. I hope we can support them to the end.

Congratulations on your 100th sector today.....not that many of us have passed that milestone!.....it would seem we are in a very special club

Absolutely will be supporting LR all the way until operations end

Jon

:-)
I just counted, and I'm at 65 LR sectors..

:-)
I just counted, and I'm at 65 LR sectors..

:-)
I just counted, and I'm at 65 LR sectors..

A mere 65 in front of me then

:-)
I just counted, and I'm at 65 LR sectors..

Just counted mine. 44 sectors at present but planning a few more before little red ends to renew AU next year.

I fly Edinburgh round trips about 4 times a year and I must say I will miss the LR flights. They've not been perfect but they've been far better than the competition. The guys in orange fly at such ridiculous hours and if you need to add in luggage they're no cheaper than LR or BA and you don't get a cuppa and a biscuit thrown in. Not sure I've ever flown a BA short haul that hasn't been delayed by at least an hour and the EDI route always seems to be disproportionately affected. They also have a tendency towards unusual biscuits. My seeming obsession with snacks aside when I first started to fly LR I was rather worried about the loads as the flights were rarely half full, but this year the loads seem to have been pretty decent so a shame they are stopping.

Sometimes VS doesn't do a good job of advertising its routes... I've still little idea what they do from Glasgow either.

April-October only
Thursday - Las Vegas (starting late summer 2015)
Friday - Orlando
Saturday - Orlando
Sunday - Orlando (school holidays only and this is a secret one as they don't seem to advertise it)

The cynic in me can't help wondering whether LR was doomed regardless of loads or numbers of connecting pax.

Even if every flight was 100% full I suspect it just didn't fit into the new "Delta UK" strategy that VS appears to have adopted.

Raffles over at headforpoints has written an interesting piece on it today. He can't think what more VS could have done to make LR a success.

http://www.headforpoints.com/2014/10/08 ... -slots-go/

They could have improved their iPhone app.

;-)

A colleague of mine flies regularly on BA (gold card).
He looked at switching to VS for some of his travel, especially with the status match offer, but didn't bother when he looked at the VS app. He likes the BA app for booking/checking in/account management, and when he saw the mess that is the VS app, that put him off any more thought about flying VS!

A poor reason for not trying a different airline, I grant you.. but that's one business pax who didn't switch.