Missing LR already !

rang FC on Sunday and started the process of booking our Jan '16 flights. Outward to MIA (for a cruise) and back from MCO (direct to MAN so good for us in the north) I knew we would have to use LHR for the MIA leg but forgot there would be no LR. so no help from FC on how to get from MAN to LHR. a suggestion we fly MAN via Atlanta to MIA was a no go as I wanted to upgrade to UC to use the CH at LHR. Second suggestion was we use VIrgin Trains - good training lady! I suggested SRB pick us up personally - laughter followed.
Our very helpful lady on the phone (in Swansea) was very patient whilst i explained I wanted to use AMEX upgrade to PE vouchers, but of course cannot use them to upgrade to UC . so.... I suggested I use miles to upgrade from Economy to UC going out LHR to MCO at 25k miles each, then use the AMEX voucher coming back and 21.25k miles , travelling PE as it is a shorter trip, but direct coming home MCO - MAN. "no problem".
We wanted to drive up Florida Gulf Coast as it is a while since we were there and is adding a week to our overall stay after the cruise.

So now have two tickets at a few pounds over 650 GBP ( where the heck is the pound sign on a Mac Book Air grrrr !!) each plus 46,250 miles each flying out UC and back PE.

sounded ok to me. But..... having to take BA shuttle MAN to LHR and a completely separate booking/search. I guess at 55 GBP (grrrrr) each that isn't too bad. but having MAN as our local 'hub' is starting to feel a bit like being 'Billy no Mates' !

I know it doesn't suit everyone due to location, but a description of the costs and time of Virgin Trains from centre of Manchester:

First class advance per person (random morning train mid april) 20 quid (10 quid standard). Will get you a drink or two, sandwich and tea as well as seats. If two of you, then two together railcard (30 quid) can get it reduced to about 13 quid per person (saving 7 quid per person, useful if going to use it a bit).

Get you there in 2 hours and 10 mins. Walk to taxi rank. Taxi to Paddington, about 15 minutes, 10 quid.

Fast train 21.50 (two together, 14 quid), 20 mins. Slow train 10 quid (6.60 if two together works, it might have minimum fare), 30 mins.

So total time, 2:50ish given change times fast, 3:00 hours slow. Cost (not including railcard, fast) 46.50pp UKP (including railcard, fast), 32.50pp UKP, (slow, railcard) 28pp, (slow no railcard) 35 quid pp.

That's first class on the VT. With a bit of planning. You don't see advances until about 8-12 weeks before the time though...

You also get the use of the Virgin Trains "Clubhouse" at both Manchester Picadilly and Euston!

You also get the use of the Virgin Trains "Clubhouse" at both Manchester Picadilly and Euston!

I would hardly call either of those a Priority Pass lounge, never mind a Clubhouse...

Oh I agree - the BA monopoly from Scotland just cost me £363 for two flights from GLA to LHR!

What mystifies me is why VS couldn't make Little Red work. It was naturally popular on here, but it was also well received by BA flyers on the BA FT forum, add in the usually cheaper fares, the status match it seems a shame. I suspect that old BA or VS vanguard just couldn't be broken completely. The UK would have been far better served if t heer two could have competed.

I think there are two separate issues.

The MAN route, by all accounts, was working - although flights were rarely full they were predominantly (sometimes as much as 90%) used by connecting passengers which was the whole raison d'être of LR. But they're not BMI remedy slots - they belong to VS which clearly believes it can better use them elsewhere.

EDI & ABZ, however, are largely point to point traffic and, although the EDI flights are often full, they're not delivering the long haul traffic VS wants.

Ultimately we're a relatively small country with good railways so maybe there just isn't the market for two full service domestic airlines not to mention the LCCs.

I know it doesn't suit everyone due to location, but a description of the costs and time of Virgin Trains from centre of Manchester:

First class advance per person (random morning train mid april) 20 quid (10 quid standard). Will get you a drink or two, sandwich and tea as well as seats. If two of you, then two together railcard (30 quid) can get it reduced to about 13 quid per person (saving 7 quid per person, useful if going to use it a bit).

Get you there in 2 hours and 10 mins. Walk to taxi rank. Taxi to Paddington, about 15 minutes, 10 quid.

Fast train 21.50 (two together, 14 quid), 20 mins. Slow train 10 quid (6.60 if two together works, it might have minimum fare), 30 mins.

So total time, 2:50ish given change times fast, 3:00 hours slow. Cost (not including railcard, fast) 46.50pp UKP (including railcard, fast), 32.50pp UKP, (slow, railcard) 28pp, (slow no railcard) 35 quid pp.

That's first class on the VT. With a bit of planning. You don't see advances until about 8-12 weeks before the time though...

This is what I'm thinking of for our next trip...

Struggling to find £20 first fares to Euston thoigh. What dates/times are you seeing these on?

Surely VS could simple have included a BA flight from MAN to LHR on your overall booking? My ex AMS to Vegas has been ticketed by VS (932 prefix) and includes BA flights between AMS & LHR.

Surely VS could simple have included a BA flight from MAN to LHR on your overall booking? My ex AMS to Vegas has been ticketed by VS (932 prefix) and includes BA flights between AMS & LHR.

Well Vegascrazy I agree but the operator and I did discuss the trains and SRB for a few minutes and I did say " guess we will have to find our own way then?" and at no point was the option you suggest even given to me.

there HAS to be some thought given to this by VS though. I agree about the trains and did think about getting to Chester (our nearest station) and taking trains / taxi but to be honest it seemed a bit tiresome and I did think 55 GBP ea and now booked and secured well ahead was the easy option.

we are now flying BA the night before as our MIA flight leaves midday and we want to enjoy the CH having been once before a few weeks ago and really thought it made an excellent start to our holiday. So an overnight hotel stay - can't decide which yet - then off early to the CH for breakfast, champagne etc then off to MIA

Becoming a bit of a spoilt brat where flying is concerned ......but will never take it all for granted......

That's first class on the VT. With a bit of planning. You don't see advances until about 8-12 weeks before the time though...

This is what I'm thinking of for our next trip...

Struggling to find £20 first fares to Euston thoigh. What dates/times are you seeing these on?

How far ahead are you planning? I found holidays like Easter and such actually have their advances released much closer to the time, chased them for ages last year to get an easter advance.

You won't see advances further than 12 weeks ahead. And that's often quoted by my experience is much more 8 weeks. I chose middle of April. Oops, fundamental fail, it was 40 quid (I've often been booking 2 people at once, so automatically halving the prices. But not on this search).

I was seeing about 20 odd quid on my route on Wolverhampton, so was associating it with that.. But not done the advance for a while...

That's first class on the VT. With a bit of planning. You don't see advances until about 8-12 weeks before the time though...

This is what I'm thinking of for our next trip...

Struggling to find £20 first fares to Euston thoigh. What dates/times are you seeing these on?

How far ahead are you planning? I found holidays like Easter and such actually have their advances released much closer to the time, chased them for ages last year to get an easter advance.

You won't see advances further than 12 weeks ahead. And that's often quoted by my experience is much more 8 weeks. I chose middle of April. Oops, fundamental fail, it was 40 quid (I've often been booking 2 people at once, so automatically halving the prices. But not on this search).

I was seeing about 20 odd quid on my route on Wolverhampton, so was associating it with that.. But not done the advance for a while...

.... and to be honest the thought of leaving the arrangement for getting from north Wales to LHR until 8-12wks in advance was giving me the shakes - I like everything sorted and then can relax months in advance. I was on the phone to FC exactly on the day the flights home from MCO were released for Jan 30 2016, at 7am on a Sunday.... that is how organised I like to be ! I know there are others like me out there ! ..... I have studied the Form on the Forum..

.... and to be honest the thought of leaving the arrangement for getting from north Wales to LHR until 8-12wks in advance was giving me the shakes - I like everything sorted and then can relax months in advance. I was on the phone to FC exactly on the day the flights home from MCO were released for Jan 30 2016, at 7am on a Sunday.... that is how organised I like to be ! I know there are others like me out there ! ..... I have studied the Form on the Forum..

Actually, you'd book the segment of North Wales to wherever connecting (Crewe might give you more options, Glasgow, Liverpool and Manchester trains), and then do an advance from there (lose the ability to book advance if you are not going VT station to VT station).

I know we are institutionalised due to the nature of booking flights so far in advance to book the connection that far in advance. However, there are trains every 10-15 minutes to London from the likes of Crewe. It's not a problem to get an advance on one of these even on a few days notice. Also allows the flexibility of some great offer coming up as an alternative...

The downside of Virgin Trains though is the peak time from Euston coming back. If off a 10am arrival, you should make an advance booked well before peak time (15:01 to 18:44). Virgin are usually fine with delayed flights (my 2 hour delay from Cancun was changed immediately, especially when it was seen as Virgin Atlantic).

However, if you come off one of those BA flights, which land about 2pm (Vegas, Vancouver for instance), you're slap bang in the middle of virgin peak time from Euston. Which has absolultely NO advances.

But was calculating yours on a one way...

The passing of LR is so sad for those of us who live miles away from that 'little town in the South East'. We use the VTregularly from Liverpool to visit family in Kent and it is a really excellent service at reasonable cost, outside peak. However the thought of coming off a red eye with 3 suitcases and 2 hand luggage and having to get to Euston would be a nightmare at our advancing age. We are now looking at ways we can connect through Atlanta using the only full service British airline that flies from the NW!!! Maybe if we all provide VA with more business they will build us a lounge in Manchester.

I have a feeling that the MAN-ATL route will do well for VS as it will really open up a lot of connecting options for the north, and avoid LHR.

Hmmmn, a clubhouse in Manchester would be nice...

However, I can't really understand the hate for the Virgin trains and how it can seem so far.

You come off a VS Transatlantic in T3. Through arrivals, then?

With LR, you'd be getting to Terminal 2, going through security again, sitting for a hour (with a reasonable connecting time) in a lounge. Estimate, I guess, 40 minutes plus wait time.

With VT, you'd be getting to the Express. 15 mins in a taxi (underground is the pain here, price and time can be avoided cheaply), then to the lounge in Euston. About 35 minutes as well. I usually have a nice sleep in the 2 hours on the train back in First Class...

Will get you a train direct to Liverpool, vs landing at Manchester airport, getting through arrivals and off to car park (inevitably miles away).

I get it going via Atlanta, but to be frank that would be a massive pain at the beginning of the journey more than the end...

I have a feeling that the MAN-ATL route will do well for VS as it will really open up a lot of connecting options for the north, and avoid LHR.

I think Virgin could capture a bunch of business with new Manchester routes...

With VT, you'd be getting to the Express. 15 mins in a taxi (underground is the pain here, price and time can be avoided cheaply)

Another driver in the taxi equation is the fact that the ex Paddington options will only get you to Euston Square, not Euston Station, without a change.

Another driver in the taxi equation is the fact that the ex Paddington options will only get you to Euston Square, not Euston Station, without a change.

Yes, we did the journey once without Oyster cards, dragging cases down to Euston Square and down those stone steps. Cost nearly a tenner and took about an hour.

Going down Victoria or Northern Lines and switching might involve less dragging down stone steps. But takes longer.

Swore to always use a taxi after that. I always regard The circle line as being one of London transports fails.