New upper class seat

So just a couple of weeks to go until (let’s be honest, something more exciting than Christmas!) the new VS upper class seat on the wonderful A350.

Until last week I would have bet a years wages that BA would not be able to get close to virgin with their new business offering but....... wow, the new BA Club seat looks outstanding!

So what are we expecting on the 8th? A jazzed up delta one suite, something completely different? All those years ago VS went against the grain with their business product (herringbone as a posed to reverse H) can they do the same again?

Would love to hear the thoughts of fellow Virgin Atlantic “upper class appreciation” people.

I’m excited to see what the new seat will be although I honestly think that business class has come so far that it’s at the standard of first class of 10+ years ago. I imagine that VS will release something aesthetically beautiful and hopefully functional, but I don’t think there is much room left for anything ground breaking unless they cut the seat count and install first class style suites with business class fares.

Agree with the OP about BA's new seat. Looks fantastic. If that ever appeared on the routes we take it would probably win us over to the dark side. At 6ft 6 with size 15 feet one thing that has always bugged me about Upper Class is that regardless of aircraft it always seems like every person walking past manages to bash into my toes/feet if I want to stretch out...which I usually do! The suite doors may be mostly gimmick...but would prevent people brushing or bashing any part of you as they stagger down the aisles.

...I'm guessing it will be a while / if ever that those BA seats appear on Caribbean routes! There would not be much competition between that and the A330-200 seats...

Read on another forum that all seats will face the window with a shield protecting your head from the aisle, so no more anyone banging into your feet

My profile picture is my guess for the next upper seat, the latest version of the Safran (Zodiac) Cirrus seat - Like Cathay Pacific. But I think it will be quite customised for Virgin. Have heard the bar is impressive on the A350 too.

Still hearing that there are no plans to retrofit the current fleet though.

...I'm guessing it will be a while / if ever that those BA seats appear on Caribbean routes! There would not be much competition between that and the A330-200 seats...

BA are only retro-fitting the LHR fleet (100 aircraft in 4-5 years), LGW are keeping current Club World for now, currently half way through refurbishing their 777's

My profile picture is my guess for the next upper seat, the latest version of the Safran (Zodiac) Cirrus seat

Wondering what makes you think that? To me it doesn't seem very Virgin but to be honest thy have changed quite a bit so I really don't know what to expect. Also would be a shame if they don't change their mind on reconfiguring current fleet given they'd be going from one of the most consistent airline to least. While all the attention is on new UC seat, do we think they might be doing something revolutionary in PE?

Premium on the 350 is 2-4-2 as on the DL
config 350s so I would imagine that’s virtually a carbon copy.

Also my belief is that they are hedging their bets.

The company really has just launched a new strategy, one of expansion and diversification which has bridged the end of the Craig Kreeger leadership into the Shai Wiess one. That strategy, partially through happenstance with the 787 issues has lead to some experimentation with the 332's, and a new product launch with the 350's.

I think time will tell, if revenue is up, and the new routes, the expansion of Manchester etc is all very successful, then there would be cause, and probably a need to take out the options for further 350s, OR have the 332's become a permanent solution. I think that's the point when the decision will need to be made on standardisation and aligning the products in J across the aircraft types.

Agreed. There won't be an indication of whether the seat will be retrofitted until there's at least a gauge of customer reaction...

Another potential angle is the status of Connect Airways.

No one (to my knowledge) knows what the new set-up will look like, but if the intention is to offer an integrated product, the potential exists for a new short haul business product, and that may have to dovetail with the long haul product (which is in a state of flux for the reasons set out above).

Window facing with full flat bed recline (no flip over). All revealed on 8th.

When and how is it being revealed ?

I think there's an event in London for the press.

[mitchja]

April 8th is the date as well.

I think there's an event in London for the press.

The event is at VS 'The Base' over in Crawley on the evening of the 8th. I'll be there and will post up whatever photos of the eve that I am able to do so. Can't wait

Another potential angle is the status of Connect Airways.

I'm also excited to see how 'Virgin Connect' turns out. I really hope that DL give VS some guidance with the a/c turnarounds. Fingers crossed the new domestic and potentially EU airline formed gives BA a run for its money... if nothing else to push BA into making competitive leaps in service... new CW is a nice example What may happen to CE with a competing player on the field

I can’t believe that in a competitive enviroment, European business class hard product is so poor compared to Asian and American markets!

This being said I very much doubt with a regional operation that VS would challenge that out right.

I can’t believe that in a competitive enviroment, European business class hard product is so poor compared to Asian and American markets!

This being said I very much doubt with a regional operation that VS would challenge that out right.

But the environment that you describe as competitive is worldwide. Shrink the environment (market) into a more regional perspective and BA has little to no competitive challenge from a UK perspective.

As an example, if you focus the 'environment' that BA inhabits against the ME3 then who would win in your view for aircraft hard product? or perhaps even AA or DL domestic hard products against what BA offers throughout Europe?

If VS, granted with DL help, launch a truly stellar product on Virgin Connect(or whatever it will end up being called) it will undoubtedly challenge the hold that BA currently has on the market.

All said it is a fascinating topic of discussion ColOrd, that I think may boil down to comparative market demands. Do you agree?

It’s a very interesting debate, and I personally am willing to put hard cash down for more legroom and a bigger seat, something that’s virtually non existent now on Short Haul J. Yet Across the pond you get exactly that.

Personally, I just can’t see VS and DL trail blazing something like that though!

It’s a very interesting debate, and I personally am willing to put hard cash down for more legroom and a bigger seat, something that’s virtually non existent now on Short Haul J. Yet Across the pond you get exactly that.

Personally, I just can’t see VS and DL trail blazing something like that though!

Just my opinion, but I think here in Europe we can forget about any sort of short-haul business class product that is in line with what you can get in North America. Part of that is down to the proliferation of LCC's attracting almost everyone bar those who wouldn't be seen dead on them, but many people just aren't willing to pay the prices that will need to be warranted for short distances and I suspect the likes of BA, KLM, Lufthansa, Air France etc. would have something by now if the market was there. There's also the issue of APD for UK-originating flights pushing prices further up. Finally in some countries, there's also high speed rail.

The best one can hope for if you value space is exit row seats or a long-haul aircraft being rostered for a short-haul flight and booking engines allowing you to select a seat in what would be a business cabin for long-haul flights.

The on-board short-haul F and J product may be better in the US, but remember in most cases it doesn’t entitle you to lounge access.

The on-board short-haul F and J product may be better in the US, but remember in most cases it doesn’t entitle you to lounge access.

And you don't always get a meal! Food in BA CE is far better too (comparing hot main dishes), would be nice to get a snack basket too though.

Food and drink we had on Delta Domestic First was excellent on JFK-MBJ (apparently that's domestic to Americans! ).

What about a Spirit Airlines 'big up front seat' approach? With what i imagine connect airways is wanting to be (More flights out of LHR and MAN) they can't compete with LCC's on price regardless of what planes they have so they might as well have a shot of revolutionising European air travel for the good.

I think you hit the nail on the head there Jake and its the big unknown question really...what is VS Connect wanting to be. Is it just a feed in for VS long haul ops, or are they wanting to carve a genuine market out of the regional travel market that BE serves?

Not to mentioned problem of obtaining slots at Heathrow. It’s anyones guess I suppose...